About us


Victor Tiffany, political activist: Victor has an MA in the Social Sciences from Binghamton University. He was active in the nuclear freeze campaign in the 1980s, and after the Citizens United v FEC decision he became active in the movement to amend the Constitution to overturn that and all related decisions. He has taken a leave of absence from his role as the senior columnist for The Amendment Gazette for the duration of this campaign. He wrote for the Syracuse Progressive Examiner until they went out of business in July of 2016. While studying the illegitimate Supreme Court decisions that granted the rights of individuals to associations and established the doctrine that money spent on electioneering is protected by the First Amendment, he became aware of how far from the Framers’ vision the United States has become. He resides in Ithaca, NY. The following is a talk given by Victor in February of 2015:

[youtube https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bjdcanXK4zo]

Garry Thomas

Garry Thomas, political reformer: peace activist and originator of the write-in idea. While not an organizer with Citizens Against Plutocracy, he realized the only way to prevent Senator Sanders from suing political parties that might want to nominate him to run on their ballot line is to organize a write-in campaign. He said, “if Bernie Sanders did not want to run as a third party candidate and be a ‘spoiler,’ there’s nothing to stop us from writing him in when we vote in November;” and the light bulb clicked on. Between that conversation and the launch of our strategy, we discovered primary season leverage. He also resides in Ithaca, NY.


Niko House, political activist and commentator: Niko is a former paralegal in the United States Army, where his job was to draft charges, help with investigations, and advise leadership in legal decision making. He is a former student at UNC at Chapel Hill where he was majoring in political science with a concentration of international relations. He is planning on attending law school to study real property, human rights, and constitutional law. He is 27 years old and he graduated high school in Fayetteville, NC.

Currently, Niko has put his education on hold in order travel the country and investigate the corruption that was going on within the both the DNC and Hillary Clinton’s campaign.


Larry Snider, a political activist: Larry has spent the last 2 decades campaigning for progressive Democrats. He believes that unless there is a fundamental paradigm shift in America’s political establishments the issues that face today’s working class will never get resolved. In the past he has volunteered as a grassroots activist for MoveOn.org, Democracy for America and Progressive Democrats of America. During this time Larry has watched the movements to reform the Democratic Party come and go, none of which he feels was even remotely successful. During the 2016 Democratic presidential primary he volunteered for Bernie Sanders campaign and was active in the Bernie or Bust movement. Due to the open and blatant election fraud in the primary, that benefited Hillary Clinton, he found himself questioning if the Democratic Party still has the ability for reform. The silence of almost all elected democrats on the election fraud has caused Larry to leave the Democratic Party. He has spent the time since the primary was over forming Jacksonville, Florida’s first Green party local chapter. He currently serves as Co-chair of the local. Larry believes that one of the most effective ways to force the Democratic Party to reform is to create a 21st Century version of the Granger Movement. He is often heard saying either we vote the corporatist out in the primary or they lose the general.


Sabrina Giesler, educational and political activist: Sabrina has based her life in the study of children and education, backed by a desire to improve the quality of education for all children. A vigorous activist from the early age of 12, when moving from small town Colorado to the progressive energy of Los Angeles, California, and a new discovery of thought and personal philosophy were introduced. From that moment, everything from equal treatment for all to the environment to politics to marijuana legalization, became a part of the focus of her life.  Sabrina has engaged and represented her ideals with actions like marching and campaigning for multiple candidates over the years, ongoing educational outreach efforts about the environment and the state of education itself, becoming the Secretary for Wyoming NORML, representing the Grassroots actions for the county of Carbon Wyoming and various other statewide endeavors in Wyoming on behalf of the 2016 Grassroots Revolution, on down to simply voicing progressive ideas where they are not so commonly heard. Now as a Mother of two, these ideals have been both superseded and yet made even more pressing. Her main tenant is that our children depend upon us to fight for their future. She believes that through efforts such as those made by groups like Revolt Against Plutocracy, through support of candidates actually representing the voices of their constituency, through forming a coalition of informed citizenry who refuse to accept the degradation of the environment, our children’s education, the starvation of uncountable children around the world, through all of these things, that WE CAN AND WILL CHANGE THE WORLD! ”



John Rachel, political activist, author: John has a B. A. in Philosophy, has traveled extensively, is a songwriter, music producer, and a writer. He has written eight novels and three political non-fiction books. His most recent polemic is “The Peace Dividend: The Most Controversial Proposal in the History of the World.” His political articles have appeared at OpEdNews, Greanville Post, and other media outlets. Currently in development is a new novel set in Japan, and another in Africa. Author Rachel has explored thirty-four countries since leaving America August of 2006. He is now somewhat rooted in a small traditional farming village in Japan near Osaka, where he proudly tends his small but promising vegetable garden.



Chris at Standing Rock
Chris at Standing Rock

Chris Christian, political activist and Wyoming horsewoman for over 45 years, in areas of speciality ranging from women and children’s rights – taking it as far as to place her personal home on the map of the underground railroad getting victims to safe houses – to medical marijuana reeducation and legislation – as founder of Wyoming’s NORML chapter and Director for three years – to working on a large number of Democratic campaigns through the years and including her own 2016 campaign in support and recognition of Bernie Sanders request for supporters to run in their local elections; Chris challenged the GOP incumbent, Marti Halverson, Wyoming State Congresswoman, in her local elections.  An election which became an educational adventure, that provided Mrs. Christian a very close and personal experience with the undermining tactics that neocon-liberals will employ against True Progressives; “I have campaigned in the past most recently for a seat in the Wyoming House of Representatives – I received the smallest number of votes…” Christian is fond of stating, almost as a badge of honor for continuing always, the fight against the corruption of our political system.  The latest undertaking by Mrs. Christian, now in her 70th decade, was an overnight, winter stay at Standing Rock, where her bio picture was taken.

246 thoughts on “About us

  1. Claudia Davison

    Revolutionaries need a plan to sustain their objectives. I believe our first step is to get money out of politics. The Citizens United decision prompted me to adapt unique career experience to campaign finance reform. The gratis result is legislation titled The Fair Elections Fund–a Whole New Ball Game, at http://www.thefairelectionsfund.com. OpEdNews published my article on how it was developed, A Path to Choices, at http://tiny.cc/thdhux.

    Your thoughts and sharing would be appreciated.

    Claudia Davison

  2. Rita Walpole Ague

    Hang in there, great Bernie supporters. Lots and lots we’ve gotta do, to get Bernie into office, and help him as he leads us/U.S, in this political revolution that, let’s hope, will implode this evil coup d’état.

  3. Grace Alexander

    This is a great idea; but, there is a BIG problem with it. People’s entire ballot will be thrown out if they do NOT do this properly and I don’t see you telling them how to do it. Remember, every State is different. If we do that in Michigan…our whole vote will be tossed. It would seem to me that your idea is meant to split the ticket and give the election to the Koch boys. I must warn people against following this plan!!

  4. pjwalkerzorro

    Grace, we like the first part of your comment (educating people about the write-in process–which we NEED to do but still have well over a year).. We’re seriously baffled about your second part, which totally contradicts your opening words “This is a great idea.” If you think it’s a great idea, why are you worried about “splitting the ticket”? Frankly, if that happens, we consider it the Democratic Party’s fault for the sleaziest bait-in-switch in history: sacrificing an honest, truly representative candidate like Bernie Sanders to the corrupt Hillary Clinton, whose sole purpose (beyond personal ambition to be first woman president) is to make us all dance the tyrannical tune of her plutocrat donors. If Dems are willing to do THAT to their progressive/populist base, they deserve to lose EVERY presidential election.

  5. David H. Schraeger

    Add my name demanding that the Warren Wing endorse “Bernie,” only Bernie, with no possibility of endorsing Hillary if she ends up with the nomination.

  6. pjwalkerzorro

    David, thank you so much. If enough people react like you, we’ll be on our way to good government in no time.

  7. Anonymous

    I pledged. FYI on your about Bernie page exployer block all the upload due to “security certificate”

  8. johnspritzler

    Do you aim to remove the plutocracy from power (which necessarily entails creating an egalitarian society with no rich and no poor, that is not based on money but rather on the principle of “From each according to ability, to each according to need”)? If so, how come you don’t say so.

    I edit http://www.PDRBoston.org , which discusses how to remove the rich from power, for real, not just how to limit their donations to politicians or lobbyists while still leaving them with their billions of dollars and hence the real power in our society in which money is power.

  9. Karen anderson

    Please put “sign the petition” as a top level menu item.

  10. Karen anderson

    I meant “take the pledge.”

  11. polwhiz

    Karen, it’s on the top-right hand margin. The tabs at the top are reserved for important information, and the home page is all about the Bernie or bust pledge.

  12. rhonda

    We were wondering, some of us Sanders supporters have signed your endorsement petition but were confused because unlike normal petitions it dud not ask our names or anything. Why is this?

  13. Don Harris, founder- Voucher Vendetta

    I can’t find any contact info on your site other than facebook or twitter,etc. I wanted you to consider another approach to campaign financing that could help Sen. Sanders campaign. This can be done in addition to your efforts. No sense putting all your eggs in one basket. Please check out http://www.vouchervendetta.org for more information.

  14. Hep

    Please change your font to something LEGIBLE. SMH.

  15. effectivenessactivator

    1 million videos on the search engines are better than 1 million signatures.

    Do not get me wrong signatures cool and all, just not as cool as videos that are available to be seen 24/7.

    Come to think about it videos on search engines are cooler that tv ads, radios ads, bumper stickers, t shirts!! You name it, videos on search engines are cooler, in my opinion.

    What say you?

    Work with me and we can get 1 million videos on the 4 most popular search engines. Page 1 on Google, Youtube, Bing and Yahoo. When the million videos are there how many views we gonna get??? Youza!!!

    Forester Research says 1 minute of video gives the same benefit as 1.8 million words.

    Work smarter, not harder!!

    I have examples of my video ranking prowess and the plan to get Bernie Dominating the search engines with videos from his believers. Stories sell, facts tell.

    Wanna see what 10 videos on Google Page 1 looks like? I can show you. Only page 1 on Google with 10 videos on it about a political candidate.

    Work with me to get thousands of pages like the one I got!!!!

    Call me, maybe?

    I am the Bazooka, get me to the knife fight.

    Scott Powell. Samples for your amazement on request.

    919 548 2437

  16. Julie A. Richards

    Link in the main page – Will you take the Bernie or Bust pledge? http://wp.me/p6itlU-74 – does not take you to https://docs.google.com/forms/d/1fUL4amIrdA-tuTy5nFTRZu4kRNFaUOEk6hA7kxSKtoE/viewform

  17. Glenn

    Unfortunately, I feel this does more harm than good, and the Bernie Sanders Campaign would agree. When I volunteered at the Seattle Rally, his staff were very clear that if Bernie loses the primary, he will throw his support behind whoever wins the Democratic Nomination. It’s a tough pill to swallow. But if we don’t all back the Democratic Nominee, and we rip ourselves in half during the General Election, a Republican WILL win. This is not the pledge we should be signing. The pledge should be that we do all within our power to secure him the Democratic Nomination. That’s why Bernie made the decision to run on the Democratic ticket in the first place. It is the only way he will win. He will not win with a write-in campaign, and not just because 7 States don’t even allow write-ins. That path only means a Republican victory.

  18. Robert Saunders

    This is very wrong because it is anti-democratic. I would sign it if it were changed to say that I would write in Bernie if he had the most elected delegates but lost because the super delegates overrode the will of the voters, but that is not what it says. It simply says if Bernie doesn’t win the nomination I would write him in. If Hillary or Biden got the most elected delegates, then we must support them because that is the way a democratic primary should work.

  19. polwhiz

    Robert, since when is the Democratic Party democratic? Do you know who elects the super delegates? No one. The pledge is a counter-weight to their undemocratic influence. Let us know when you’ve complained to the DNC about how undemocratic the “Democratic” Party is.

  20. polwhiz

    You’re wrong. The campaign follows us on Twitter and knows very well what we’re doing. Several people have communicated to them about us, but no one has told us to stop this recruitment.

    Dems have to choose between backing Bernie Sanders or else they may well lose the election. The ONLY way he will secure the nomination in the corrupt and rigged Democratic Party is if there is leverage and insurance for him. That’s what 1-2 million pledge-takers offers him.

    Your fears of a Republican victory are OUR tool. Be afraid; be very afraid! If Sanders is not the nominee, the Democrats may lose the general election. They will have only themselves to blame.

  21. polwhiz

    Robert, we say that too. This is both leverage and insurance.


  22. xplorer1959

    Nice. If you can’t win fairly, then cheat, blackmail, lie, pledge that if you can’t get your way, then turn against your own country like a typical traitor. You’re a pathetic bunch of FAKE progressives.
    Fascists in Bernie clothing….

  23. polwhiz

    Blaine, I take it you’re a #CorporateClinton supporter. This is a revolution, and we will use any and all legal means to abolish plutocracy. Read “Our goad: democracy.” We’re the most radical democrats involved in this struggle against oligarchy and plutocracy.

    If you think Clinton’s super PACs are about “winning fairly,” then you need to look up the word “fairness.”

  24. polwhiz

    Thank you for bringing that to our attention. It’s been repaired now.

  25. sharonlynneroarkart

    You want 2,000,000 signers. How about letting everyone know how many we have? A bar graph or other suitable chart?

  26. effectivenessactivator

    Love the passion you folks have.

    Signatures are awesome, keep up the good work.

    I am trying to get people to make video testimonials because they are visual and auditory commercials and when I post them I can get 10 on the first page of Google.

    Anyone reading this ever see 10 videos on Googles main page 1?
    I can do this for Bernie the same way you folks get signatures…with help.

    Do personal sight and sound commercials who run 24/7 in every city in America made by Bernie Supporters that are on the 4 most used search engines help Bernie?
    The answer is yes.
    The next question is then will you help?
    If so get in touch. Make a video and give me 5 minutes a day.
    Together we can help in a way not being done yet.

    Help me help Bernie, make a video and get two folks to do the same every week and just imagine.
    Scott Powell

  27. Betty Martin

    MAKE the PLEDGE BUTTON more OBVIOUS… some people won’t persevere to find it… !

  28. Name withheld because I don't want my name in any way associated with this Citizens Revolt Against Plutocracy. It's crap.

    I have no clue what you think you’re going to accomplish. You’re going to threaten who with this leverage? Undecided Democratic voters? Clinton super-delegates? You expect this to HELP Bernie Sanders? Seriously? This reads like kind of astroturf dirty trick stunt I’d expect the Koch Brothers to pull.

  29. Get All Neolibs Out of the Democratic Party

    Name withheld… It’s a pledge, a threat. It’s to get the attention of the DLC, etc. How else would you do so? Seriously, I’m open to any and all viable options, and possibly some that are not.

  30. polwhiz

    Be afraid, Glenn; be very afraid. He will secure the nomination or there will be a Republican victory.

  31. polwhiz

    Lone fish @aol.com, If we’re conservative, Koch-Brother-loving, right-wingers or anything of the kind, you can have our votes for Hillary. Unfortunately, what you’ll discover is that we are life-long progressives who, like Sanders, has fought against corporate control of the country, racism, imperialism, and the destruction of the poor and middle class for decades. In other words, we’re not guilty of what you are groundlessly accusing us of. If we gave a shit, we’d say you owe us an apology. But from what we’ve seen in this particular go-round of HRC’s vaulting ambition, her supporters are instructed to accuse all her critics of being Tea Party members, Republicans, shills for the radical right wing, etc.

    We don’t know who or what you are. We do know what Hillary Clinton has stood for and done over the last 50 years. It’s not liberal, it’s not progressive, and it’s only “Democratic” thanks to what she and Bill and their allies have been allowed to do to our party. The fact that there have been multiple and evolving definitions of “neoliberal” is irrelevant. The current meaning is clear and it fits the Clintons and the “New Democrats” to a tee. Live with it. Own it. Embrace it. But don’t tell us or any critic of HRC that we’re right-wingers. That’s a cheap and transparent trick that fools no one but you and your fellow Kool-Aid drinkers.

  32. Stan Shapiro

    Stupid, stupid idea. It actually creates no leverage because Hillary voters are not going to be blackmailed into supporting Bernie, but it does succeed in infuriating them for being typecast as Republican-lite voters or tools of the Dem bosses. If Bernie wins, many Hillary supporters will be curbing their enthusiasm big time not because they’re pissed at Bernie, but because they’re pissed at supporters like those driving this campaign. And, of course, if Hillary wins and people actually follow through by not voting for her, you will all have to live with your consciences as a crazy, fascistic Republican President turns our country back to the 18th century.

  33. Tom Fusco

    Is it true that you are creating a PAC?

  34. polwhiz

    We created a PAC back in June because we need to tell Democrats it’s Bernie or else they’re on their own. Click on the donate link at the top-right for more information.

  35. polwhiz

    Stan, we’re about to find out. If Hillary loses, it’s not on us. We’re letting Dems know: #UniteBehindBernie or else lose the general election. The ball is in their court, a problem they can solve by supporting Bernie Sanders.

  36. Stan Shapiro

    Actually it IS on us. As in the roof will crash on ALL of US, including Bernie supporters if Trump/Cruz/Rubio become the next President with a Republican, neo-fascist Congress and a similarly inclined Supreme Court for the next 20-30 years. You’re not immune from the effects of your own blackmail. And I know, your answer is it doesn’t matter because Hillary and Trump/Cruz/Rubio are the same and stop talking about the Supreme Court, etc., etc., etc. And that response is just deliberate ignorance, or to put it another way, the last nail in our collective coffins in which we will all — most decidedly including you — be buried.

  37. polwhiz

    Stan, your fear is OUR tool which we plan on making us of. Thank you for spelling out exactly the danger of the Bernie or bust pledge. We write: “No doubt, some skeptics will wonder if the Bernie or Bust pledge is like the wildly desperate guy–aiming a loaded pistol at his own head–who declares, “if I don’t get my way, I’ll pull the trigger.” That is like the Bernie or Bust pledge. You are a Sanders supporter. The threat to “pull the trigger” is the refusal to vote for a status quo Democrat even if it pushes a Republican in the White House.”

    We will pull the trigger, so Democrats had better understand that this is a problem only THEY can solve: #UniteBehindBernie or else!

  38. Stan Shapiro

    polwhiz, what a great way to win an election, blackmail. Very progressive. And, as I’ve said and spelled out, also very, very, very stupid.

    Btw, your enemy “Democrats” isn’t just the manipulator class; it includes millions of rank and file Democrats, many of them poor and working class women and people of color, who simply wish to exercise their democratic (small “d”) right to disagree with you on your candidate choice. It’s pretty small and disgusting of you to try to coerce them to vote for your candidate — and mine. It’s not the way we should try to win. It’s certainly not Bernie’s method. But you’re so obviously smarter and more decent than Bernie, so blackmail away to victory.

  39. thepoliticalmormon

    Have you thought about opening the data? It would be cool to have a real-time counter of people filling in the pledge. Knowing there are a million signatures, goes a LONG way to convincing Hillary supporters that if they want a Dem in the oval, that it must be Bernie.

  40. Stan Shapiro

    politicalmormon, you don’t mean convincing Hillary supporters, you mean blackmailing them. What a despicable, undemocratic tactic in support of a democratic socialist. Don’t you have enough confidence in Bernie’s message to try using that to bring over Hillary supporters rather than coerce them?

  41. polwhiz

    Stan, blackmail is illegal. This strategy is using leverage which is perfectly legal. You are not happy with this strategy, but that’s too bad. We expect a lot of spit and anger coming our way, so nothing you write is surprising in the least. If you think #CorporateClinton is such a great candidate, get to work for her. On second thought, keep coming back here and wasting your time spitting foam nails at us. We think it’s charming.

  42. polwhiz

    Patrick, the data is coming in on six different spreadsheets. There’s no way to produce a real-time counter. We try to keep the count updated daily.

  43. polwhiz

    The only thing that will be “stupid” Stan is if Democrats do not unite behind Bernie, divide the American left and help elect the Donald. THAT would be stupid. We are presenting the Democrats with a “Ralph Nader” problem. The difference between 2016 and 2000 is that this time, Democrats can solve this problem by supporting Bernie Sanders.

    Starting in five nights, our plan shifts into phase two: we apply this leverage in the IA caucuses. That’s when Clinton’s supporters are going to feel the Bern.

  44. thepoliticalmormon

    well, let me know – I could help you create a form that integrates with a single mysql db, and then just create some sort of json endpoint that updates in realtime. 🙂

  45. Stan Shapiro

    You all are ridiculous and no one, except me to my chagrin, is paying attention. If there is a single Hillary supporter that is comandeered by your oh, so scary, scary behavior, to switch and vote for Bernie, you will convince me. Why don’t you just have a single one of them come post here and tell us all how terrified they were of you that they switched. How ludicrous! Produce one. Let them post anonymously. I want to hear how little they cared about Hillary, not to mention their pride, that they let you bully them into voting for someone other than who their conscience demanded. Or are you so oblivious that you don’t think anyone could vote for Hillary in good conscience? Maybe that’s what they taught you on your home planet.

  46. 60 year old female capitalist egalitarian deep thinker from Iowa

    Because immediately reversing the unsurvivable, automatic, ceaseless flow of wealthpower from the global working poor to rich freebie-getters, which is happening 24/7/365 courtesy myriad legal thefts embedded yet unrecognized in our economic dystems – because this comes first, I will caucus for Sanders on Monday in spite of his actual foreign policy record. But if, in the end, he isn’t the Dem nominee I will not give a write in vote to a guy who tells me to shift my support to Clinton. I will never be Kuciniched again – though it didn’t work on me that time, either – Obomber never got my vote, Jill Stein did. I will never sell out nor vote for a sellout, which Sanders becomes at the point he endorses the Queen of Chaos. I would have signed your pledge had it called specifically and unequivocally for all Sanders supporters to vote Jill Stein Green Party if he isn’t the Dem nominee.

    What I’d really like to know is why people fight consequences instead of seeking to know the cause of the consequences, why people with good intentions prefer to spend their time and energies perpetually begging wealthpower giants for our rights when they could instead get focused like lasers on helping the human species have the necessary ultimate epiphany: there is no REASON to HAVE wealthpower giants on this planet, there is EVERY reason NOT to. You either dig out once and for all the root cause of 99% of human suffering or you sentence yourself to the hope-fatigue inherent in perpetually striving and failing to deal with the millions of horrid, unsurvivable *consequences* of allowing the overpayoverpower-underpayunderpower dystem to continue to exist, of allowing personal fortunes to go on being unlimited everywhere on this planet.

    We humans are either going to spread the wealth in the world as evenly as the work in the world is spread – or we are going extinct. E=mc2 changed everything. We humans no longer have a choice between fairpay justice and ever-escalating miseries, dangers, and threats – this tragicomedic species have painted ourselves into a corner and our choice is now between ushering in fairpay justice and autogenocide. Injustice drives violence. The economic unjustness factor on Earth resides in the billions, and the economic unjustness factor is the violence factor.

    As things stand now this species has no future. We no longer have time – nor do we have any right – to go on seeking consensus agreement on answers to all the wrong questions. The sum total of all human intelligence that has existed so far right down thru the ages is within cooee of proving itself to have been precisely as useful to us as stupidity would have been in its place. We humans are either going to rapidly rid ourselves once and for all of the diabolically stupid, egregiously self-harming, anti-natural, unjust idea to allow unlimited personal fortunes on this sacred garden harbor spinning in space, or we WILL succumb to the results of allowing the next and the next and the next wealthpower giants to continue arbitrarily subjecting a whole planet of working people to their myopic monomania for wealthpower.

    Overpay for anyone has nowhere to come from but from underpay for others!

    It’s Fairpay Justice for us – no more overpayunderpay overpowerunderpower – or it’s history on repeat on steroids Kaboom.

    You are choosing one or the other every day, every hour.

    Don’t be a genosadist. Pursue your real happiness, safety, peace and prosperity with all mindfire!

  47. Been there, done that....

    Sad to say, if all Bernie supporters (of which I am one) follow your advice to write in Bernie, we will probably end up with a Republican president, as happened in the Gore/Bush general election.

  48. Shannon Hammock

    If there is so much disappointment with the Democratic Party and there is a willingness to support a democratic socialist, why not just support the Socialist Party, USA, America’s party of democratic socialism for over 100 years, and their presidential campaign, rev16.us?

  49. Grace Alexander

    True Socialism is not what we consider good government. A Blend of Capitalism and Socialism is what we have enjoyed for decades and we prospered. Democratic Socialism is the goal and is not easily dismissed by Corporate Fascists bent on usurping a way of life that WAS the American Dream.

  50. Philip Uhrich

    For what it’s worth I think getting everyone to vote Jill Stein rather than write in Bernie would be much more effective. If enough people did then that would really show the democratic party: adapt or die.

  51. polwhiz

    Read the pledge. It was updated to ad “or vote Green Party” last month.

  52. polwhiz

    Read “Revolution.” Lesser-of-two-evil voting is a con job. Democrats have a choice: #UniteBehindBernie or lose the election. That is precisely what pledge-takers are telling voters.

  53. Don Harris, founder- Voucher Vendetta

    It is good that you updated your pledge to include voting for the Green Party. Please consider updating your approach by encouraging Bernie supporters to also participate in Voucher Vendetta a campaign financing approach that can extend Bernie’s small contribution model to congressional and senatorial elections in 2016.
    This will make it possible to elect 10-50 candidates that finance their campaigns with small contributions to Congress in 2016. This will make it easier for Bernie to get things done if elected and will further discredit the argument that Bernie will not be able to get anything done.
    Bernie has proven that small contributions can work. The Tea Party has proven that less than 20% of general election voters can be effective by taking on the establishment candidates in the primaries. This approach combines these two proven approaches.
    Just the current Bernie supporters alone also participating in Voucher Vendetta for congressional and senatorial elections could make this approach effective in 2016. Just the celebrities and organizations of Democracy Spring alone could do the same. Together they would make this approach a likely probability rather than just a possibility.
    There is still time for this approach to be effective in the 2016 congressional primaries if your organization gets behind this idea and puts pressure on Democracy Spring to also participate.
    With the support of these groups we could easily get 15% of the general election voters to commit to only voting for congressional and senatorial candidates that finance their campaigns only with small contributions from individuals in the 2016 primary and general elections (More details at http://www.vouchervendetta.org).
    Because less than 50% of general election voters vote in the primaries, this 15% will total more than 30% of the total primary vote voting for small contribution candidates for Congress and the Senate. In congressional primaries where there is no small contribution candidate on the ballot citizens can write in a small contribution candidate or write in their own name to register a vote against the Big Money candidates and create demand for small contribution candidates in the 2016 general election.
    This will inspire more citizens to participate in Voucher Vendetta in the general election, 20-30%. This will encourage independent, third party and even a token current major party candidate in a safe district for the other current major party to run as a small contribution candidate in the general election. This will result in 10-50 small contribution candidates elected to Congress in 2016 and several gerrymandered safe districts destroyed when the other party wins due to a small contribution candidate acting as a spoiler.
    This will inspire more citizens to participate in 2018, 30-40%. This will result in more small contribution candidates elected and record voter turnout in 2018.
    Think about the 2014 elections and the 30% of 2012 voters that did not vote in 2014 because they did not want to vote for Big Money candidates in a rigged election. What if just half of them had instead gone to the polls and wrote in their own name as described above ? How many small contribution candidates would already be running in the 2016 primaries and how different would the 2016 elections look now ? Where would Bernie’s campaign be now if he didn’t have to spend the first 6 months or so proving that small contributions can work ?
    The results of 2018 will inspire more citizens to participate in 2020, 40-50%. This will make the majority of congressional districts into districts with competitive small contribution candidates in 2020.
    Will any campaign finance reform legislation or constitutional amendments be passed and implemented by 2020, much less in time for 2016 ?
    This can be implemented under current election law so citizens can start participating today.
    And the Big Money interests will have a difficult time branding this as socialism because it is based on the free market principle of supply and demand, requires no government money and puts no legal restriction on anyone contributing to anyone. The restrictions all come from the application of their free market principles by average citizens.

  54. Don Harris, founder- Voucher Vendetta

    RAP should start putting pressure on Superdelegates now by starting a petition asking Superdelegates to commit to putting greater weight on their state’s primary vote over their own personal preference for president. Superdelgates could personally endorse Bernie or Hillary but would commit to casting their Superdelegate vote to the winner of their state primary or to work with other Superdelegates of their state to make sure the Superdelgate votes reflect the results of their state’s primary.
    Combining this petition with the campaign financing approach in my previous comment would put additional pressure on the Superdelegates because there would be some small contribution candidates running against the Superdelegates in the primaries and general election. Some Superdelegates will switch their Superdelegate vote to Bernie to try to save their own campaign.

  55. […] experiment I propose is massive organized voter revolt, by means of Revolt Against Plutocracys Berni... darkpolitricks.com/2016/02/no-reforming-democrats-leftist-dogma-or-scientific-fact
  56. polwhiz

    If Bernie wins a majority of pledged delegates, we’ll be in Philadelphia to let the super delegates know it’s Bernie or bust, Bernie or the GOP will win the general election in November.

  57. Don Harris, founder- Voucher Vendetta

    Did you mean elected delegates? If Bernie wins pledged delegates doesn’t that mean he won the nomination?
    If you wait until the convention to put pressure on the superdelegates with some sort of protest it will be too little, too late. A protest like that should be a last resort just like your Bernie or Bust pledge.
    You seem much too eager to reach the last resort. If your goal is to get Bernie elected then you should be doing everything you can to make sure that the last resort is not needed.
    And getting citizens to extend Bernie’s small contribution model to congressional and senatorial elections in 2016 as described in my Feb. 12 comment will increase voter turnout which will help Bernie both get elected and be more effective if elected. So do you want to get Bernie elected and start getting the Big Money out of the entire process or do you want have to make a valiant protest as a symbolic last resort?

  58. polwhiz

    The Bernie or bust pledge is leverage that’s currently being deployed in SC. It’s not a “last resort.”
    Our agenda is all about getting big money out of the entire process.

  59. Don Harris, founder- Voucher Vendetta

    I do agree that the Bernie or Bust pledge can have an effect on the presidential primaries. But the threat of a general election write in vote for Bernie is just one front in the battle. Even if Bernie is elected it will not change the Congress much.
    Extending the small contribution model to congressional and senatorial elections in 2016 and getting citizens to use a write in vote in the congressional primaries to create demand for small contribution candidates in the 2016 general election gives you an opportunity to demonstrate your commitment to reforming the whole system now and your ability to get citizens to use the write in vote making your general election threat more credible.
    It will increase voter participation because people will see that they can actually change the whole system and not just the mostly symbolic change of electing Bernie president. Because it only requires minimal citizen participation it will get many citizens that are not zealots to participate. They will not march in the streets- but many will be willing to sign up on the website, tell some friends about it and vote. They will never become zealots- but Bernie cannot succeed without them.
    As for the Big Money out of politics your approach requires electing Bernie and passing legislation with the same basic Big Money Congress. Let’s not forget that Citizens United resulted from a challenge to Mccain- Feingold.
    What I am proposing requires no legislation, no government money and can be implemented immediately, right now- today. It will put small contribution candidates in office in 2016, more in 2018 and make the majority of congressional districts into districts with competitive small contribution candidates by 2020.
    Will any legislation be passed or implemented by 2020, much less in time for 2016?
    Bernie supporters need to take off the blinders and see the big picture. I understand that polwhiz has be a Rubiobot and tow the company line- but isn’t there anyone else that has signed the petition that wants to chime in ? I thought Bernie supporters were supposed to be open to new ideas and different approaches.

  60. Laurie Katz

    I came to sign your pledge but I know little of the Green Party. I know I will write in Bernie Sanders. I will put a link in to your page, I hope you will do the same so that people like me who at least know we will write in Bernie Sanders can sign.
    Best of luck to all of us, we are going to need it 🙂
    Or as my hero Ben Franklin said, “we must all hang together or most assuredly we will all hang seperately”.

  61. Desertstraw

    I support Bernie and I will not vote for Clinton but hell will freeze over before I vote for the anti-Semitic Green Party.

  62. Laurie Katz

    Desertstraw, I am just starting to learn about the Green Party. Can you point me to the information or tell me how they are anti-Semitic? I am not arguing, I just know nothing at all about them.

  63. polwhiz

    Desert Straw, first we’re not endorsing Stein. Several candidates are running for the nomination. Second, she is Jewish.


  64. polwhiz

    Thank you. Yes, we can make “or vote Green” a link to their platform.

  65. polwhiz

    “I understand that polwhiz has be a Rubiobot…,” Don, if I’m a conservative, Rubio-loving, right-winger or anything of the kind, you can have my vote for Hillary. Unfortunately, what you’ll discover is that I’m a life-long progressive who, like Sanders, has fought against corporate control of the country, racism, imperialism, and the destruction of the poor and middle class for decades. In other words, I’m not guilty of what you are groundlessly accusing me of. If I gave a shit, I’d say you owe me an apology. But from what I’ve seen in this particular go-round of HRC’s vaulting ambition, her supporters are instructed to accuse all her critics of being Tea Party members, Republicans, shills for the radical right wing, etc.

    I don’t know who or what you are. I do know what Hillary Clinton has stood for and done over the last 50 years. It’s not liberal, it’s not progressive, and it’s only “Democratic” thanks to what she and Bill and their allies have been allowed to do to the Democratic Party. The fact that there have been multiple and evolving definitions of “neoliberal” is irrelevant. The current meaning is clear and it fits the Clintons and the “New Democrats” to a tee. Live with it. Own it. Embrace it. But don’t tell me or any critic of HRC that we’re right-wingers. That’s a cheap and transparent trick that fools no one but you and your fellow Kool-Aid drinkers.

  66. Laurie Katz

    It took me a moment to realize I could sign this pledge, or maybe it was rephrased while I reloaded the page. It says “or vote Green”, it doesn’t require that I vote for a Green Party candidate, but the big point is to make to the powers that be at the DNC, and make it now while there is still time for them to save the party. Not that I care about any party but it would be a much faster route to use what already exists.
    Great article In the Observer expresses it well, “If Sanders Loses, Bernie Believers Will Take the DNC Down
    The Democratic Party may want to reconsider how they’re gambling”
    And that is the whole point of this pledge. Last chance for the DNC to reconsider this ill advised path they’ve chosen.

    Frankly I don’t think they will see reason, and hopefully this will be the end of the DNC, as our country groans through another revolution. That party can go the way of Whigs and Federalists and all the others left in the history books.

    It is also counterproductive to vilify Republican voters, the same as the idiotic strategy of the DNC hacks vilifying Bernie supporters. (They can’t attack squeaky clean Bernie so they attack the electorate? Oy.) Republican voters are American people like ourselves, we’re all trying to get proper representation and a LOT of them would vote for Sanders, they have a pledge too on FB, a very good one.

    It is US against THEM, but the US is all the American voters and the THEM is the corrupt two party system as it stands, bought by Big Money.

  67. Laurie Katz

    And to Don, it is counterproductive to clutter up the discussion here with what we probably all agree is necessary as you said, “Extending the small contribution model to congressional and senatorial elections” and that is exactly what Bernie has been saying, he can’t do it alone, we have to make the point to our representatives that we’re not going to return them to office unless they get a clue. I get it also that you think it has to be in this election, simultaneous to getting Bernie elected, and that would be desirable. Maybe you have noticed that trying to organize 51 states during a presidential election is like herding kittens. Let us unite under the effort to get Bernie elected, which will also send the needed message to the people of the 50 states, and their elected representatives. If they aren’t already noticing now, and if Bernie isn’t elected, we will still have the elections in 2018.

    Stand united.

  68. Don Harris, founder- Voucher Vendetta

    Your answer about the Rubiobot reference actually shows that you did not understand the reference. I called you a Rubiobot because you provided stock answers to my previous post which just repeated your talking points and did not understand or address the points made in my post. it had nothing to do with you being right wing.
    As for who or what I am. I will never vote for Hillary- she is Republican Lite like her husband and Obama. I voted for John Anderson in 1980 and Ralph Nader in 1996. I write in my own name rather than vote for one of the current major parties if that’s all that’s on the ballot.
    It is obvious that you feel the Bernie or Bust pledge is not a last resort. I understand that which is why I wrote that it SHOULD be a last resort and that Bernie supporters should be doing more than just throwing all their eggs in one basket, they should being doing everything they can to help Bernie get elected.
    I am not your enemy. I am not trying to convince you to abandon your idea. I am trying to point out that there is a greater opportunity and other ways you can help Bernie.
    Despite your antagonistic responses, I appreciate the opportunity to discuss my ideas and your idea and hope that if this discussion continues you will make a better effort to understand and respond to my points of discussion which you still have not done.

  69. Don Harris, founder- Voucher Vendetta

    Laurie Katz
    Thanks for chiming in. Just like my Rubiobot comment please don’t take this as an insult, but you kind of contradict yourself when you say that what I am proposing may be necessary or desirable but we should not try to achieve it because all we are capable of in 2016 is electing Bernie and other things should be put off until sometime in the future. Isn’t that what Hillary supporters say about Bernie’s campaign?
    Bernie supporters need to take off the blinders and see the big picture. My idea will actually help Bernie because it will get many people to participate that never did before or that have given up because they will see that the whole system can be changed, not just the mostly symbolic change of electing Bernie president. And Bernie needs increased voter turnout to be successful.
    Bernie supporters are always complaining that others do not think big enough and claim they believe in “Yes we can” instead of “No we can’t” or “wait until later”. Again, this is meant to make you think, not as an insult- now the shoe is on the other foot.

  70. Rachel

    Hurrah Hurrah! Congresswoman Tulsi Gabbard Steps Down From DNC, Endorses Bernie Sanders!!!!! (NPR, various sources)
    Gabbard, 34, is one of the youngest members of Congress and the first Hindu elected to Capitol Hill. She served in Iraq and with the Hawaii National Guard, and cites her military experience as the impetus for her decision to back Sanders.

    “As a veteran and as a soldier I’ve seen firsthand the true cost of war,” she said. “I think it’s most important for us as we look at our choices as to who our next commander-in-chief will be … to recognize the necessity to have a commander in chief who has foresight, who exercises good judgment.”

  71. Lew Friedland

    The suggestion on the main page of your website about using the ‘nuclear option’ along with the photo are pretty offensive and almost caused me to not sign the petition. Please use a better phrase to describe the alternatives that are possible.

  72. polwhiz

    If changing the rules for how the Senate votes on bills and nominees is called the “nuclear option,” why not the Bernie or bust pledge?

  73. Don Harris, founder- Voucher Vendetta

    The “nuclear option” is a good description for the Bernie or Bust pledge. But lets move beyond that tactical deployment and nuke the whole system by mobilizing Bernie supporters to vote in the congressional primaries for small contribution candidates or write in their own names to create demand for small contribution congressional candidates in the 2016 general elections.

  74. Anthony

    You have on your home page that “Senator Sanders is calling for a top marginal tax rate of 90%” which is wrong. He specifically said his top tax rate would be no where near 90% which was what it has been in the past. That’s Fox News propaganda. Even if you clear 5 Million a year as a head of household you’ll pay out about 32% of that 5 million. He’s progressive, he’s not insane 😛

  75. polwhiz

    I guess President Eisenhower was “insane” because the top marginal tax rate was 90% during his entire administration.

  76. Anonymous

    This has got to be a Republican dirty trick. Fall for it if you wish but you are being as big an idiot as the Trump supporters.

  77. polwhiz

    Anonymous, if I’m a conservative, Koch-Brother-loving, right-winger or anything of the kind, you can have my vote for Hillary. Unfortunately, what you’ll discover is that I’m a life-long progressive who, like Sanders, has fought against corporate control of the country, racism, imperialism, and the destruction of the poor and middle class for decades. In other words, I’m not guilty of what you are groundlessly accusing me of. If I gave a shit, I’d say you owe me an apology. But from what I’ve seen in this particular go-round of HRC’s vaulting ambition, her supporters are instructed to accuse all her critics of being Tea Party members, Republicans, shills for the radical right wing, etc.

    I don’t know who or what you are. I do know what Hillary Clinton has stood for and done over the last 50 years. It’s not liberal, it’s not progressive, and it’s only “Democratic” thanks to what she and Bill and their allies have been allowed to do to the Democratic Party. The fact that there have been multiple and evolving definitions of “neoliberal” is irrelevant. The current meaning is clear and it fits the Clintons and the “New Democrats” to a tee. Live with it. Own it. Embrace it. But don’t tell me or any critic of HRC that we’re right-wingers. That’s a cheap and transparent trick that fools no one but you and your fellow Kool-Aid drinkers.

  78. Carlo Flores

    Please don’t let the GOP win the presidency. I understand your anger, but letting Trump or Cruz win would send the nation into a chaos, and you all will be the first to complain, despite your bailing on Clinton (assuming she was the nominee) who would be a hell of a lot better than Trump or Cruz. You don’t understand the consequences your actions could bring upon you, your families, and the nation. Your anger is not unwarranted, but your actions will be. How could you let the very symbol of what you are fighting against (Trump) be the president? Sure Clinton is a part of the DNC Base, but she is not advocating for punching people in the face and throwing them in jail, while offering up an unrealistic wall and deporting millions of innocent civilians that are undocumented, looking for a better way of life. Swallow your pride for the sake of the people you love and the people of this country that want to have a bright future in it. As a member of the next generation in this country, I plead with you to not abstain from voting for the Democratic nominee (again, assuming it is Clinton), for you we will not look back on you as heroic revolutionaries, but rather as prideful individuals that helped destroy the nation that we will have to fix for us and future generations to come.

  79. Laurie Katz

    This is not intended as a reply on Anonymous’ thread, but I can’t figure out how to start a new one so here goes.

    First I’d like to thank the Bernie or Bust folks for having this open forum and for answering posts. This is a pretty rare thing.
    And of course for the petition.

    Now to say something incendiary, but I think its important for Bernie supporters to understand how they are being manipulated. I am a yyyyuuuugggeee Bernie supporter. Signed this pledge. This is what I must say: Trump is not a racist. You have to already know this. They have grabbed some sound bites and yes he has said some stupid things but that doesn’t make him racist. You have seen this man for 30 years, hanging out with LaToya Jackson, Snoop Dog, he’s been endorsed by Mike Tyson and Medgar Evers’ brother… Remember Omarosa? The second Apprentice winner, Kwame? And using the Nazi symbol to protest a man whose daughter converted to Judaism in 2009 and who has Jewish grandchildren is completely out of line. Yeah he’s for deportation and building a wall, but Obama’s deported millions and continues to, does that make him a racist?

    More importantly, Trump is for the most important same points that Bernie is for:
    Stop the wars
    Investigate the Fed
    Kill the bad trade deals
    Don’t touch Social Security
    Change the way elections are run

    and this is why the RNC is trying to sabotage Trump while the DNC is trying to sabotage Bernie. Its not Republican vs Democrat, its the VOTERS against both parties.

    Taking the bait and pitting Bernie voters against Trump voters is the RNC-DNC dream.

    We should be smarter than that. Keep your eye on the real enemy. We’re going to need the Trump supporters and they are going to need us.

    Note also that at the supposed riot at the rally, NONE of the violence was from the protesters or the rally attendees, it was ALL the POLICE.

    So Anonymous, you’re just taking the bait. You might think – as Bernie said – that Hillary is better than Trump. Trump did not send back the Honduran children, Trump did not approve the Iraq War and 250,000 dead, Trump did not support the TPP… If I can’t have Bernie, I am voting for Trump.

  80. Laurie Katz

    Carlos, Hillary is far, far worse than Trump. Trump didn’t send hundreds of thousands of people to their deaths. Today Hillary is apologizing for saying Nancy Reagan was a ‘very effective, low-key’ AIDS advocate. This statement alone is far more repugnant than anything Trump ever said. I am of that older generation and although you are right about us screwing things up for you, you haven’t learned about what happened in the 80s and 90s and how monstrous Hillary and Bill were, how we’re now paying the price. Watch this video, then you will begin to understand.
    There is nothing that could make me vote for Hillary.
    And if you have a moment, please look at my other post to see how we’re being fooled into thinking that Trump is the enemy.
    This is all staged to deprive the electorate of the real choices we have, never Hillary.

  81. William K.

    I’ve been a serious music composer for about 9 years, so I can compose music for those TV ads (or anything else). I’ll be happy to do it for free. My music leans Classical, so it would be a good fit for accompanying visuals (like in TV ads). Hit me up with an email if you’re interested, and we can discuss specifics. – William K.

  82. William K.

    The same offer about music goes to you too, Don Harris/Voucher Vendetta Founder. 🙂

  83. Don Harris, founder- Voucher Vendetta

    Thanks again to RAP for this forum. Even though PolWhiz still has not addressed the points in my comments, this forum has allowed me to get this idea to some other people.
    We should also thank Bill Maher for mentioning RAP. Based on the amount of recent comments it seems to have brought some additional traffic to the site whether that was his intention or not.

  84. Don Harris, founder- Voucher Vendetta

    William K.
    Thanks for your offer and considering Voucher Vendetta. You may change your mind if you can find my YouTube videos “I am Trumpface” (Iron man song parody) and “Trumpface sings This Land is my land” when you see what i might do to your music. You can contact me through the Voucher Vendetta website.

  85. William K.

    Thank you for the kind reply, Don Harris. 🙂

    I looked for those two videos on youtube, but I didn’t find any with those exact names, and I don’t have a way of knowing which trump-themed songs/videos are yours specifically. I don’t think they’d make me change my mind though, because I can also write lyrics and (probably) get singer friends/acquaintances of mine to sing them.

    I’ve actually been thinking of doing an anti-Hillary song for some time now (not sure how many pro-Hillary people would even see it with the internet being its main spreading vehicle), but now I’m thinking of doing bigger-picture/longer-term stuff like trying to replace the democratic party with the green party over the next 10-20 years, running incumbents against every corrupt democrat (which is most them) in 2018, etc. – which (yes, for any pro-Hillary people who may be reading this) means republicans winning general elections for as long as people who vote for corrupt democrats keep voting for corrupt democrats. And all of this needs to be done regardless of what happens with Hillary v. Bernie v. Trump in the next year.

    Also, I had a bit of trouble contacting you via email on your site. I’ll try again though.

  86. Stan Shapiro

    Let’s just hope that after you help Trump become President that your plan to create a third party or transform the Dems or whatever isn’t blocked by a Supreme Court that affirms every Republican bill in the country designed to take voting rights away from exactly the people who would vote for that progressive entity. So go right ahead, elect Trump with your oh so brilliant suicidal strategy and then see if you can make the corpse of democracy rise from the dead.

  87. Laurie Katz

    Stan, take a breath… I know its scary to hear what the media is saying, cherry picking parts of Trump’s speeches to get the juiciest, scariest bit. The point is to scare you. There’s only two candidates who want to get out of the endless wars, investigate the Fed, rebuild the infastructure, and kill the bad trade deals. All the others want more war, more money printing, more jobs and industry going to the poorest nations, who then have to vie against each other for the most meager pay.
    Neither Bernie nor Trump have ever said anything about taking voting rights away from anyone, (to the contrary, for Bernie he wants to allow felons to vote). Trump also wants to change the system. He admits he took advantage of it, but its legal, and its wrong.
    Every Muslim I know, and I know many, would gladly wait hours and be full body cavity searched at the airport in return for ending the damn wars- and that’s because they are human beings, like any other sensible human being who isn’t grossly profiting from the wars, that is the big issue.
    Hillary and the rest of the GOP are going to kill people. They have done it before, they will do it again. Trump is all kinds of gross but you never hear of his buildings collapsing or him being responsible for anyone’s death.

    Another point i just realized… after reading how Hillary and her DNC cohorts send out Bill Clinton to campaign. If BC picks his nose, it makes the news. But Bernie, you know he can’t get a moment of air time. So many people not voting for Bernie because they never heard of him, never heard his platform, those are the people who don’t use the Internet, and even the Internet is obviously poisoned by establishment media. I couldn’t figure out why Bernie was bothering to feed the Trump fire, or why Trump was attacking Bernie more than Hillary. Then I realized that Trump was giving Bernie a gift. Trump gets media, and how, and that’s why he says those things. He’s tricking the media into publicizing him. By bringing Bernie into it, he’s giving Bernie more media time. Hillary and the DNC have broken every rule to get more media time, they are spending more and more and more to fight off Bernie, and Bernie keeps winning over voters.

    I do know how you feel. I was a mile away from the WTC on 9/11 and I was so terrified I believed there were WMD in Iraq. They use fear to manipulate you. Just for a moment, think about it without fear, of voting rights, of deportations (which continue mercilessly, 11 million…) of rampant racism… listen to more than just the clips of a Trump speech, look at his platform, remember his best friends are Snoop Dog, Mike Tyson, Dennis Rodman, LaToya Jackson…

    Remember that the establishment is going completely berzerk trying to stop Trump (same as Bernie). Why would they want to stop Trump? You think they give a crap about voting rights, civil rights, voters, the country, racists? No, I know you don’t. The media/establishment/RNC doesn’t want Trump because he’d stop the WARS and the Trade agreements and he’d investigate the Federal Reserve, all the banksters who are destroying the country and the world.
    The banksters own the RNC, the DNC, the Supreme Court… see the movie An Inside Job.

    If I can’t have Bernie, I am voting for Trump.

  88. Stan Shapiro

    Well that’s royal. You actually think the Mussolini wannabe is better than Hillary and that he would stop the all out assault on voting rights that the Republicans realize is the only way they have to protect their oligarchy. Voter ID, Citizens’ United, racial gerrymandering, ending early voting — all things promoted by the right and fought by the Democrats — are going to either be protected or overturned by the Supreme Court appointed by the next President. It’s the Republican judges who’ve been upholding these things and put three more Scalias on the Court and you can kiss your voting rights goodbye. But who cares? Trump/Mussolini will be there to protect us all.

  89. Laurie Katz

    I didn’t get past your first sentence of insults. I mistook you for a thinking man. My mistake.

  90. Stan Shapiro

    Sorry for insulting you by acquainting you with the reality of what a Trump administration will do to your right to vote.

  91. Stan Shapiro

    And also, as to how much Trump cares for working people, he’s called for a multi-trillion dollar tax cut for the rich and lower wages. And as to his desire for peace in the middle east or elsewhere, he’s for ripping up the Iran deal and belligerence toward everyone, everywhere. Starting with beating up protesters, something no other candidate seems interested in doing. He’s as peaceful as Mussolini. He’s pulled the wool over the eyes of millions

  92. greenvoter2016

    As a progressive voter, I share your disgust for HRC. Yet if Sanders endorses her, as he promises to do, why write-in his name? That sounds like an actually wasted vote: for a candidate who would no longer be running.
    I ask you instead to singularly endorse the Green or other specified third party, if you consider this a revolution. It’s got to have somewhere to go. The Green Party will be on the ballot in most states and is ready to contain the revolution long after Sen. Sanders has returned to his Democratic caucus in the Senate.

  93. Stan Shapiro

    I’m ready to vote Green when the Party acquires the slightest chance of actually electing anyone President, which means it must have at least a modicum of institutional support from any part of the progressive spectrum of organizations. Right now its candidates have zero such support. Therefore it has no chance of electing Jill Stein or anyone else President and a vote for her is a vote for Donald Trump. Own it.

  94. Grant C

    While I appreciate the sentiment and goals that drive a write-in pledge, it’s bad strategy. In many cases a write in will not even be tallied or counted if the person you put down does not register themselves as a write-in candidate… depending on what state you are writing them in from. The vote will simply be thrown away as cast for an ineligible candidate.

    If the Democrats make Clinton the nominee the best course of action for Sanders supporters would be to swing as much of their support as possible to Jill Stein in the Green Party. Her platform lines up very well with Bernie’s and if the Greens can break just 5% nationally then they will secure guaranteed ballot access and federal election funding next election. and that has the potential to scare the crap out of the Democratic establishment because they know they’ve been screwing over the liberals and progressives in their party by moving more and more and more right (at least economically while they collect their payoffs) for years and using the fact that it’s them or the even worse GOP to blackmail those voters into taking it and voting Democratic anyway. But give even a hint of a viable progressive alternative that can be used as a real protest vote and the left wing of the Democratic electorate could start peeling off, which would force the Democrats to turn left to protect their flank and start taking the left’s policy demands seriously.

    Seriously people, fight like hell for Bernie through the convention…. but if they give it to Clinton then the best alternative course from there is Stein if you want to do something that might have an impact.

  95. Grant C

    Anyone actually voting Trump as an alternative to Sanders is absolutely insane, just to make that clear. Who you vote for sends a message. If Trump wins with a very large vote in his favor as opposed to winning because the Democrats split their progressive support with a real liberal party than the message received will not be “oops, the Democrats moved too far right and lost support”. It will be “Look at all those votes for Trump the country wants us to move EVEN MORE right! Charge!”

    You could not pick any course of action better designed to make sure you get the opposite of everything Sanders is fighting for.

  96. Laurie Katz

    When the general election comes I will be looking for the best option to keep Hillary out of the White House. Of course also the non-Trump GOP candidates.
    Like you said, I will do all possible to get Bernie elected first. Then its just about who can beat Hillary and the other warmongers.

  97. Laurie Katz

    Grant, you gotta do more research.
    Like here is a good article:
    Military Times- Troops want Sanders or Trump
    Look at Trumps actual platform, don’t rely on clips or the media.
    And please, stop putting other people down.

  98. polwhiz

    Grant, we make it as clear as we can. “Unlike Gore vs Bush vs Nader in 2000, Democratic primary voters will have the choice this year to unite the broad, American liberal/progressive left behind Senator Sanders or risk putting another Republican in the White House. The Bernie or Bust campaign puts the burden of unity on them.”

    No one here is recommending voting for Trump. There is a “Bernie or bust” effort out there recommending that, but we are not and will not become associated with that person’t approach. Anyone but Bernie is the opposite of what Sanders is fighting for except the Green Party. That’s one reason we added “or vote Green” to the pledge.

  99. polwhiz

    We will probably make that recommendation to the pledge-takers.

  100. Grace Alexander

    I am not alone when you hear that we will NOT vote for HRC….we WILL vote for Stein for the reasons you have mentioned – and more.

  101. Carly Ansara

    What we urgently need to do is organize Bernie or Bust! rallies nationwide starting in mid-June, to be followed by a mass March on Philly on July 25th, in time for the start of the Convention.

    The superdelegates can’t be cajoled. They must be “threatened” with the loss of the general election.

  102. Laurie Katz

    What we urgently need to do is to get out the vote for Bernie, especially in California and NY. Bernie is in striking distance of winning the nomination, despite the media drumbeat. Check out this page: http://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/election-2016/delegate-targets/democrats/
    The big wins in Utah and Idaho didn’t garner many delegates BUT overall, HRC is starting not to make her targets to stay on track and Bernie is starting to catch up.
    Yesterday Bernie had 86% of his target, today he has 89%.
    Bernie needs 120 delegates to get back on target, HRC is 119 ahead of her target.
    Also helpful, Cruz is starting to pick up steam. Although Bernie polls MUCH better against Trump than HRC, against Cruz HRC only comes to a tie and Bernie beats him by 13 points.
    So for those loyal democrats who just want a democrat to win, they can now see the advantage of Bernie over HRC without qualification, without waiting for HRC to be indicted, or looking carefully at their choices. Whoever this Bernie guy is, he is more likely to win in November.

    As much as I am VERY grateful for the Bernie or Bust movements, I have signed all pledges, they are the fall back if Bernie doesn’t get enough delegates.
    HRC supporters dig in their heels against all reason when confronted by Bernie supporters.
    The key is getting people to register and vote for Bernie.

    On that score, its hard for me to believe that NY would vote for HRC. I was a NYer for 20 years, HRC did absolutely nothing for us, and she blocked Caroline Kennedy’s possible bid for Senator. But after seeing what happened in the South, and reading Larry Kramer’s response to HRC’s inexplicable horror statements about Nancy Reagan being a help during the AIDS crisis- Larry saying that he was going to support her and she better apologize or he’d change his mind- I fear that the Gay community will follow in the Southern Civil RIghts footsteps and vote against their brother, against their own best interests, against their country.

    So its just utterly beyond important to reach out in every way possible, phone bank, volunteer, and get Bernie to the convention in Philadelphia.

  103. Laurie Katz

    Oh and… about the Superdelegates, you probably already know if Bernie gets enough pledged delegates, the Super delegates shouldn’t be a problem. As one article pointed out, they are all politicians so they’d be the first to abandon whoever is down to save their own skins. Cross that bridge if we come to it.

    Also, aside from the mainstream media’s continuing outrageous bias against Bernie, and their backhanded mea culpas, there is this article from yesterday’s Marketwatch and a few others peeping their head out, just to cover their butts I assume in the case that Bernie does indeed get enough delegates from the remaining states:

  104. polwhiz

    Carly, those are good suggestions. The whole concept of Bernie or bust is to threaten the Democrats with loss of the general election if they don’t back Bernie.

  105. William K.

    Thought you might like this article, polwhiz:


    It takes a while to get to its point, but when it does… 🙂

  106. Laurie Katz

    I must apologize, I was tired when I read your post and confused “March” the month with “March” the verb. I agree we must start organizing and demonstrating now. Especially the face of continuing and escalating voter suppression and the other raft of dirty tricks to subvert the will of the electorate.
    Arizona is only the latest.
    I live near Philadelphia and happy to assist locally.
    Victor knows how to reach me.

  107. Jim Piddock

    I love Bernie and have been a supporter of his for years. But this type of campaign is very short-sighted and destructive. If you want Trump, Cruz, or some other GOP troll running the country, this is exactly the way to do it.

  108. polwhiz

    That’s up to the Democrats, Jim. We’ve taken a stand against Wall St-backed neo-liberalism. If Democrats want Trump or Cruz running the country, then they can nominate #CorporateClinton. The burden is on the voters and superdelegates to unite the broad left. If they refuse to do that and nominate a DINO like Clinton, then that’s their problem. If Democrats refuse to follow Bernie’s light, then they can run from Trump’s fire. It’s up to them.

  109. polwhiz

    William, Patrick Walker is one of the co-founders of Revolt Against Plutocracy. He writes in CounterPunch, Nation of Change and Op-Ed News.

  110. Stan Shapiro

    You keep saying if we have Trump or Cruz it’s “their” problem. No it’s OUR country; you can’t exclude yourself from it because of a fight you’re having with the Democratic Party.

  111. William K.

    I ended up writing this in a music forum, and I figured it would reach more people here. Feel free to keep it, delete it, or re-post it as you see fit. It’s essentially a blueprint for the political revolution to come. I would love to hear feedback as well, since multiple heads are better than one. (I’ve already grabbed ideas from others around the net and incorporated them into the blueprint.) I’m basically just thinking that we have to strategize the coming political revolution now while we’re still united, otherwise we run the risk of becoming disparate/ineffective Independents. Through Bernie Sanders, we’ve learned that we Independents are a powerful force when united. We can’t let that dissipate after this election. Anyway, without further ado…

    Electing corrupt (“establishment”) Democrats into Congress won’t help Sanders do anything as president. Hillary Clinton is corrupt to the point where she always has and always will continue to only do what’s good for special interests instead of the people, and most of the Democrats in Congress are exactly like her in that regard. The Democrats could have done anything from 2009-2011 but chose not to do anything about NAFTA, TPP, mass incarceration, regulating Wall Street, etc. This is akin to how the Republicans could have done anything from iirc 2003-2005 but chose not to do anything about NAFTA, immigration reform, regulating Wall Street, etc. They have both shown where their real loyalties lie, and it is not with their constituents.

    This is why a growing number of folks who’ve campaigned a ton for Bernie Sanders are themselves planning to run for office in 2018, regardless of this election’s outcome. They either need to get in there so President Bernie Sanders can do stuff for the people’s benefit, or they need to get in there to stop President Hillary Clinton from doing stuff for the special interests’ benefit. They intend to replace every corrupt Democrat in congress with someone entirely new, probably running under the Green Party’s banner. I will be voting for them consistently. With 43% of the U.S. being Independent, 29% being Democrat, and 27% being Republican – plus Democrat/Republican people switching to Independent in droves – it is absolutely possible for a third party to rise up. The goal is to replace the Democratic Party with the Green Party. It won’t happen in one election though. It will, however, happen once either 1) the people who vote for corrupt Democrats realize we’ll never vote for corrupt Democrats or 2) the elderly generation passes away.

    Why the Green Party? The Green Party has their party on ballots in more states than any other third party, and it’s basically a progressive/non-corrupt party i.e. what the Democrats always claim to be but never actually are. It’s easier to take advantage of the work the Green Party has already done to get their party on states’ ballots than to start from scratch trying to get a new third party on states’ ballots. We’ll basically flood the Green Party at which point it will be ours. Then, we’ll use that to gradually chip away at the Democratic Party’s money/power/influence by making them lose general elections. In the short term, corrupt Republicans will win said general elections. Let me remind you, however, that the peaceful protests of the 1960s, in the short term, only resulted in peaceful protesters getting beaten and killed. In other words, it’s not about what happens in 2018 when the corrupt Democrats lose to corrupt Republicans because of our non-corrupt “spoilers.” It’s about what happens after several elections like that when all the blindly-loyal Democrats (a.k.a. Hillary Clinton supporters) realize that we’ll never vote for a corrupt Democrat (like Hillary Clinton) no matter how much they try to make us afraid of the Republican boogeyman (this time, Donald Trump). Either that, or they’ll pass away over the next 25 years or so, at which point no one will be voting for corrupt Democrats over our non-corrupt “insurgent” candidates.

    Most Republican politicians are corrupt too, so voting for corrupt Republicans is not a solution. We need to overthrow the corrupt DNC and the corrupt GOP. The news is telling you that the “revolution” Bernie Sanders speaks of is mere rhetoric, but it’s not. I myself will be writing in Bernie Sanders’s name for president in November and voting third party/writing in Bernie Sanders against all the corrupt Democrats on the down ballot. I will be doing that in 2018, 2020, 2022, 2024… 2050, etc. Democrats will not mistake me for either a Republican or a non-voter. Democrats will know I’m liberal on issues, and that they lost me by their being corrupt. However long it takes, that is what I will be doing.

    We will not believe corrupt Democrats like Hillary Clinton when they “move to the left” and “start talking about income inequality.” We know most Democratic politicians, like Hillary Clinton, are bought and paid for by special interests and would never do anything to address income inequality while in office. If they were going to, they would have done so from 2009-2011. Hillary Clinton “talking about income inequality” will persuade no one: we know that 4 out 5 of her biggest donors are CEOs of big banks.

    The Democrats are corrupt, and they deserve to lose. One of the best things about Bernie Sanders is that he is not a Democrat. Hillary Clinton is 100% a Democrat.

    This is coming from a young person who voted for Barack Obama, too. This is not just some old fogey being irrationally/consistently against the Democrats for no reason. The corrupt Republican politicians are evil, but that doesn’t make the corrupt Democratic politicians good. Both are evil, both need to be replaced, and both will be replaced. The revolution has just begun. It won’t end after the 2016 Democratic primaries or 2016 general election.

    As for Hillary Clinton and Donald Trump, I have no second choice. Voting for the lesser of two evils will only ever get you evil. Down with the DNC and the GOP!

  112. Claudia Davison

    William K.: We are in agreement on what is wrong and what we want. Activists are now joining forces, and have scheduled political events in Washington D.C. later this month, http://www.democracyspring.org/ and http://democracyawakening.org/.

    The Citizens United decision prompted me to draft legislation titled The Fair Elections Fund–a Whole New Ball Game, based upon years of relevant experience. It re-imagines the rally cry of the Revolution: $7.00/year for “Taxation With Representation.” Just as current campaign funders obtained the fruits of representation they “bought,” if the majority of citizens want a real Representative Democracy, we must support candidates willing to represent us. Several attorneys have reviewed it; none have found a better idea.

    You are aware that political parties are just clubs that have wedged themselves between the People and their government. They enact laws that obstruct competition, isolate disfavored groups, empower themselves and enrich campaign donors. The current “election” is a public subsidy for the selection of political party delegates who will select candidates that represent the parties, not necessarily, or likely, We, the People. The ’70’s $3.00 donation to Presidential campaigns and political party conventions facilitated that takeover. We didn’t know whose money we were supplementing. Thereafter, public subsidies to businesses increased as the wealth and influence of most citizens declined.

    Alternative proposals suggest campaigns dependent upon small donations. That is 1) insufficient, 2) unpredictable, 3) anonymous, 4) perpetual fundraising, and 5) denies citizens the right to choose which candidates may use our money. My effort is to give candidates and voters a viable, independent voice in our governance.

    Another issue is voting practices. My concern about Ranked Choice Voting is that voters may make errors that nullify the ballots. Also, in Oakland, CA, the system was manipulated in such a way that an unpopular candidate was elected. Alternatively, Approval Voting 1) dilutes the “spoiler” effect of more than two candidates, 2) identifies the voters’ second choice if the Directors remove a “winner” who cheated, 3) expedites filling a vacancy if the “winner” is recalled, and 4) informs the Electors in choosing the President and Vice President, with consideration given to their compatibility as a pair.

    It is not my place to propose how the American People may reshape their country. This is a structure for them to do so within existing law, without reversing the Citizens United decision, which still won’t eliminate fundraising or expand choices. Is your government worth $7.00 a year to you?

    Please share your thoughts on http://www.thefairelectionsfund.com, @thefairelection.

  113. polwhiz

    If Democrats nominate a Democrat in name only, that’s their problem. We will not support her, so they had better get the message and soon. #BernieOrBust means no more corrupt neo-liberals ready to sell out the American workers and democracy itself with so-called “free-trade agreements” that are Trojan jorses for fascistic, corporate rule. We won’t get fooled again.


  114. Pamela Michael


    I am a liberal Democrat but by trying to divide the Democratic vote ( no matter who gets the domination) is a dangerous and selfish thing to do. The Citizen United was not put in by the Dems -not Hillary. If you work on right ins or vote for the Green Party it will divide the vote and there is a chance that a nut case GOP could get in -there goes the Affordable Health Care or any universal health care and the EPA will be gone and things will get worse. Please be sensible and toot your horn on this after the election. Please do not undermine either candidate of the Dems for it affect my kids and grand kids and the environment!! Hold of and let`s get a another Dem in the White House and more in Congress!! A protest vote that will only feed the Republicans will be counterproductive- please hold off until after the election and pleas continue with your work then!!

  115. Pamela Michael

    Also, for Bernie or Clinton to achieve anything as President there needs to be more Democrats in Congress or it will still be lack of cooperation and blocking. no one has a magic wand, even Bernie. Please keep in mind,also, that there are Republicans posting distorted things about Hillary on line. I will support either candidate that gets the nomination but feeding into the Republican divide and conquer is unproductive . We need to get more Dems in Congress, with a Dem President to be able to achieve anything.!!

  116. Laurie Katz

    Not sure if this posted, sorry for double post if it did…
    I started reading HRC’s camps feed or something like that (I am not great at the whole tweet/instagram/reddit thing…) last night after the Nevada convention reversed HRC’s win. I learned something about Hillary supporters. They really thought that HRC had fought to get Bernie on the DC ballot. They really believe everything that Hillary is saying. This is a different light than the incessantly viterpurous and counterproductive posts I read around the ‘Net.

    I couldn’t understand before where all these robotic soldier types came from, hurling crazy accusations and name calling, like right from GO. No discussion, no civility, just nuts. Telling Bernie supporters to “get in line” and to top it off, saying that we have to vote with them in November if HRC wins. Like beating a dog relentlessly and then expecting it to uh… heel.

    But I see now that the voters for Hillary are like all voters. Seriously, enough with the hate already. Same for Bernie and Trump supporters. Ya know there’s a lot of both marching to Washington with Democracy Spring. Seems they are surprised to see each other there. And check out these Californian voters:http://www.turnto23.com/news/local-news/republicans-and-democrats-lined-downtown-streets-participating-in-todays-peaceful-rallies

    What’s really going on is what this article says from Arizona: http://ktar.com/story/992266/lets-be-honest-political-parties-are-picking-the-nominees-not-the-voters/

    Political parties are picking the nominees, not the voters.

    That’s been ticking off everyone who doesn’t support those nominees, and until Nevada, not the chosen-by-party nominees. Something beautiful happened in Nevada, when the Certification Committee made up of equal parts HRC and Bernie supporters stood together – or rather sat in together- against the Executive Committee. The Executive Committee was trying to remove one of the Certification Committee, who happened to be a Sanders supporter.

    This is the way its supposed to be.

    Never mind that I disagree with HRC and I think her supporters are misguided to believe what she says, I now believe in her supporters. Actually, I believe that they have been beaten down so long they no longer can afford to believe in the dream. They accept “incremental change” because they are terrified they would lose even more if they don’t. It goes against all reason, because we all know that to give away your negotiating position before the negotiation begins is to lose, but that is all part of the strategy of negotiation.

    So then this whole business of “Democrat” meaning something, or even “GOP” sits where I think it belongs, in the garbage. I understand now why the Hillary supporters think it is an insult to say that Bernie is a Democrat come lately. As someone who supported McGovern in 1972 although I was too young to vote, and I really wanted Shirley Chisholm, someone who had John Kerry feted at her house in 1974, someone who hung out with Abbie Hoffman after he surfaced in PA I remember when the dirty word was “Liberal”. No one says Liberal any more, now it seems to have been folded in to the “Democrat” platform. Then watered down and abused beyond the point of recognition.

    I know too little of the Green party to be able to comment on them. I don’t know if the Independent party even put a candidate up. Or the Libertarians. Or any other party. I do remember when a ballot had a lot more parties listed. I do remember that when there was a debate, it was on the BROADCAST channels, and it has always bothered me that all the debates so far are on paid channels- how do poor people watch the debates? Are they even broadcast on radio? They used to be run by the League of Women Voters, now they are what? They used to be commercial free. And lets not even start about what a delegate convention used to be…

    So Pamela, I hear you. I hear the fear you have for your children and your children’s children. I have the same fear. I think that all the VOTERS share your concern. I’m not going to try to convince you of anything. I am sorry if it frightens you, but I cannot vote for Hillary under any circumstance. I can tell you why if you like.

    Vote your conscience and good luck to us all, we are going to need it.

  117. David K?

    Can someone take my pledge down? I will either write in Bernie Sanders or vote in the Veterans Party of America. Not the Green Party. I didn’t know that taking the pledge took out the vote that I would have done, therefore my pledge is not correct.

    I will vote Bernie Sanders or Veterans Party of America. My version of Bernie Or Bust is not the same as yours.
    http://davidkrout.com/blog/what-is-bernie-or-bust/ It actually includes a third party of their own choosing.

  118. polwhiz

    David, any third party to the left works for us. What I’m not going to do is look through 69,500 email addresses to find yours to remove.

  119. David K?

    The reason I ask is because it says “or vote Green Party during the general election.” So my pledge makes the count invalid since I do not support the second option and there is a possibility that I might not do the first option in an election. I will if I can, but if I cannot, it will not be in any of those two options.

    Honestly, I believe you should include any third party instead of strictly one.

  120. Laurie Katz

    I said the same, and I think Victor was going to change it. Maybe he couldn’t because at that time there were already about 50K signatures and maybe they would vote Green if they dont write Bernie in. I know we’re both serious about what we pledge. I don’t want to mislead the Green Party. I took the domain IWillWriteInBernie.com and I linked it to another petition that says I will write in Bernie, nothing about voting for anyone else.
    I think its fair considering that November is 8 months away, and a lot can change in that time. What will not change for me is that there is no way I will vote for Hillary. I do plan to write in Bernie, and I hope that masses of Dems and GOP and Independents etc will also write him in. He could win that way.
    The point to make to the DNC is that using Superdelegates and other institutionalized cheating will not succeed in frightening a significant number of registered Dems into voting for HRC.
    I’ll look into the Veterans Party, I didn’t even know about them so thank you for that.
    By the time November comes around Bernie may say something like if he is elected by write in he will not serve. In that case I will be looking for an alternative. It could be the Green Party candidate, the Veterans party, Trump… I dunno…
    So thank you for turning me on to another alternative, and my .02 (unasked for, and apologies if you didn’t want to hear from me on this) is not to let it ride until November.
    Besides, Bernie may win the nomination :)Even Slate Mag is saying its likely to be a “contested convention”. (FCOL that’s what a convention is SUPPOSED TO BE!)
    Can Bernie Sanders Force a Contested Convention? We Did the Math.

  121. Laurie Katz

    Meant to say, TO let it ride… not to not…

  122. Rachel Corey Katz

    Finally, our message is getting through!
    25 percent of Bernie Sanders voters would shun Hillary Clinton

  123. Velma Hampson

    So this is a bunch of people who if you cannot have YOUR WAY, YOUR WAY all the time, you would rather have Trump or Cruz for president. Most of you are old enough to know better.

  124. polwhiz

    Velma, we will not be sheep. We are running out of time on climate change, and fracking Clinton will make that worse. This #leverage is a PRIMARY CAMPAIGN strategy. If “bust” results in President Trump or Cruz, then Democrats are to blame, not us. We’re the adults in the room. http://www.examiner.com/article/bernie-or-bust-pledge-takers-are-the-adults-the-room

  125. William K.

    [In response to Velma]
    With 43% of the U.S. being Independent, 29% being Democrat, and 27% being Republican – plus Democrat/Republican people switching to Independent in droves – it is absolutely possible for a third candidate to win the general election. Writing in Bernie Sanders will not necessarily result in Trump winning. This is part of why the mainstream media always dishonestly accuses Bernie or Bust folk of planning to “stay home on election day.” They want to trick people into thinking that the 43% of U.S. voters registered Independent cannot reject both parties’ candidates, but the truth is that the 43% of U.S. voters registered Independent CAN IN FACT elect anyone they want. That’s a big part of why the pledge is NOT to “stay home” as the mainstream media constantly claims. The pledge is ACTUALLY to write in Bernie Sanders’s name (or vote Green if you live in one of the 7 states that discards the ballots of write-in votes).

    [In response to Pamela]
    Electing corrupt (“establishment”) Democrats into Congress won’t help Sanders do anything as president. Hillary Clinton is corrupt to the point where she always has and always will continue to only do what’s good for special interests instead of the people, and most of the Democrats in Congress are exactly like her in that regard. The Democrats could have done anything from 2009-2011 but chose not to do anything about NAFTA, TPP, mass incarceration, regulating Wall Street, etc. This is akin to how the Republicans could have done anything from iirc 2003-2005 but chose not to do anything about NAFTA, immigration reform, regulating Wall Street, etc. They have both shown where their real loyalties lie, and it is not with their constituents.

    [In response to Pamela and others I’ve seen around the net]
    I find it odd whenever Hillary Clinton supporters try to use prescription costs or health insurance as a reason to vote for Hillary Clinton, because Hillary Clinton has taken tons of money from both the pharmaceutical companies and health insurance companies like George W. Bush did, and because of that dirty money, George W. Bush let the pharmaceutical companies charge extremely-expensive prices for drugs and told people without health insurance to just “go to the emergency room.” Hillary Clinton will do the same things George W. Bush did regarding prescription costs and health insurance because she has taken a ****load of money from the same special interests (pharmaceutical companies and health insurance companies) that George W. Bush did. Barack Obama did not take money from these two special interests. George W. Bush and Hillary Clinton did. This is one reason Hillary Clinton is NOT a continuation of Barack Obama no matter how much she claims to be. Also, this is actually my number one reason for being Bernie or Bust. It is in NO WAY a reason to vote for Hillary Clinton. It is a reason to stop her from becoming president.

    I found another great article about Bernie or Bust:
    (this time I checked the names to make sure it was written by someone else)

  126. William K.

    In addition to taking the Bernie or Bust pledge, it would be good to support/donate to this guy:

    His name is Tim Canova. He is a non-corrupt, progressive insurgent candidate running as a Democrat against Debbie Wasserman Shulz (in Florida). Because of how Debbie Wasserman Shulz is a high-profile corrupt Democrat, I expect this insurgent candidate (Tim Canova) to get more attention than other insurgent candidates we run against corrupt Democrats. So we should make an example out of the Tim Canova v. Debbie Wasserman Shulz election now by supporting/donating to Tim Canova. If we do it now, it will also show corrupt Democrats/superdelegates what to expect if they cross us. Starting now is also important because we need insurgent candidates to already have some momentum once Bernie’s campaign is done, lest we run the risk of us Bernie supporters dispersing back into disparate Independents after Bernie’s campaign. A lot of Bernie supporters only got on board after he already had momentum, basically, and I expect those same Bernie supporters to only get on board with our insurgent candidates after our insurgent candidates have momentum.

    I know it’s not quite on-topic, but it seems like a good additional move, and one that would appeal to Bernie or Busters. Let Clinton supporters fear losing to Trump, and let corrupt Democrats/superdelegates like Debbie Wasserman Shulz fear losing to our awesome insurgent candidates like Tim Canova.

  127. Laurie Katz

    Great idea. Done!

  128. William K.

    It would also be a good idea to head over here…


    And contact superdelegates to tell them how we’ll run insurgent progressives against them if they don’t switch their pledges to Bernie (like how we’re already running Tim Canova against Debbie Wasserman Shulz). I’m thinking the following would be good threats to tell superdelegates…

    If they don’t switch their pledge to Bernie we’ll…
    1) Run insurgent progressives against them in both Democratic primaries and general elections
    2) Vote for, donate to, and canvas for those insurgent progressives
    3) Look up who their special interests are and boycott the businesses of those special interests
    (Essentially, do to them what we’re doing to Hillary Clinton and Debbie Wasserman Shulz.)

    … Also, does anyone know where to find info on peacefully protesting at/just outside the Democratic Convention. If 15,000 Bernie supporters from every city go and protest at the Democratic Convention, the combined 1,000,000+ Bernie supporters protesting there will make the superdelegates see how bad it would be for them to oppose us. I bet we could flood the city with so many protesters that the city becomes paralyzed from no one having any room to move anywhere in the entire city. They can’t arrest all of us for loitering or whatever the bogus charge would be! And if the DNC gets the police to teargas us or whatever, it would make it that much easier to decimate the Democratic party in the years to come.

  129. polwhiz

    There is a superdelegate task force working on that. We are #StillSanders focused on helping him secure the nomination by deploying the #BernieOrBust army as democracy commandos.

  130. Cee

    “Bernie or Bust!” by Cee #TakeNY #BernieOrBust

  131. Carly Ansara

    Spread the word:


    Clinton’s have a shell company in Delaware but their reps deny that it is one.

  132. Michael Q. Rudnin

    Bernie Sanders himself sorta just endorsed #BernieOrBust @ 11:40 ~ trust me, you’re going to want to see this … 🙂 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kQ9G0QQpdi0

  133. Laurie Katz

    I saw that last night! It was fantastic. A great question that began with the truth- that MANY of Bernie’s supporters will not support HRC and would write him in or vote for a 3rd party or not vote at all! He told it like it is! Bernie said that he can’t direct his supporters to vote against their conscience, and that it was up to HRC to get their votes by supporting all the things we support. Bernie didn’t even say he would himself vote for HRC. It was fabulous.
    Bernie also took Chris Hayes to task about how MSNBC is owned by Comcast/NBCUniversal.

  134. polwhiz

    Thank you. We just posted it on our Facebook page. https://www.facebook.com/CitizensAgainstPlutocracy/

  135. Rachel

    Is there any reason why I shouldn’t dump my Democratic voter registration now that I have cast my vote for Bernie?
    I wonder if that might also be a good signal to the DNC…

  136. polwhiz

    We’re recommending just that. Please register Green Party; the Democrats are DINOs. We don’t need two Republican Parties.

  137. Laurie Katz

    It confuses the issue to switch parties. The point is to get the message to the DNC, in advance of the convention, that no, Bernie supporters will not “get in line” whatever candidate the DNC chooses. If they want to win in November, they’ll be smarter to make Bernie their candidate. That’s all I have to say to them.

    Its been said before by me and by others, to link our support of Bernie to supporting the Green party is diluting the point. It also makes it look like Revolt Against Plutocracy is really a Green Party promotion, not a leader of the political revolt nor a safe place for Bernistas to convene.

    I’m not pledging allegiance to any party. I only re-registered as a Dem for Bernie. The little I have read from Jill Stein is very good, and this is not meant to be a negative about the Green Party. It remains an option but I don’t need to be a member of the Green Party to vote for Jill Stein or Bernie.

    We don’t need a party. We have the candidate we want. We need to be ready to write in our candidate.
    I think if you were clearer about de-registering from the Democrat party – and not linking it to signing up to anything else, more people (like me) would get the point, and feel more comfortable signing the petition and more people would de-register.

    I know I am increasingly offended by being told who to vote for… and I saw many voters who felt the same way at my polling place. There was the instruction to vote for “4 female and 4 male” delegates. A LOT of people were saying What the hell is this?

    Please. Streamline the message. It is Bernie or Bust, not Bernie or Bust or Green.

  138. Grace Alexander

    I didn’t renew my DNC (aka DLC) membership; but, didn’t join Green. I will today!

  139. judyh

    Colorado law appears to require that a write-in candidate sign up to receive write-in votes. For the presidency, the deadline for signing up is 117 days before the election, which would be late July. There seem to be two pathways: pay $1,000 and submit 9 names in support, or submit 5,000 names supporting the write-in candidacy. The signers must be registered voters, unaffiliated, and registered on or before January 1, 2016. I would like my vote for Bernie to be counted, not just tossed out as a spoiled ballot. It will take some coordination to arrange for a write-in candidacy. Any ideas on organizing?

  140. Ronwell Quincy Dobbs

    polwhiz, you are an insufferable child.

  141. Jim

    either for Hillary or even Bernie’s camp….


    Absolutely no way.
    Not happening.
    not now.

    IF we do this thing to start the revolution,
    AND we let the Democratic National Leadership (sic)
    get away with this – then, we might as well never have embraced this
    course designed for change that we have created.

    The idea that we will let the “SUPERDELEGATES”
    and the olde establishment actualy get away with this –

    What if I told you, hey, guess what, it’s not over…

    yes, that is right… IT IS NOT OVER PEOPLE !!!!

    If we do not make the Superdelegates change their mind –
    then, we need to show them two possible
    sets of consequences.

    One, Donald Trump becomes the next President.
    WHY ?
    We are not voting for Hilary.
    WE have made this abundanty clear –

    Just becasue the Democratic Leadership (sic) has their fingers
    in their ears going lalalalalalala —— andf then, they want us to
    grow up ?

    We are not voting for Hillary even if
    she promises to change her agenda.
    WHY ?
    WE do not trust Hillary.

    Let me repeat that – y’all are quite thick…

    We do not like having the access to voting tampered with.

    We do not like having trolls rolling on in to tell us what a
    nice fight we put up and now it is time for us to be reasonable –
    to grow up –

    OR to use Clintons “code speak” we need “dreamers” and “doers” —
    what an insult to our intelligence. Definitely meant as a “put down”.

    Well, this is what we are “doing” —
    we are sticking to our guns.
    (now, go away trolls)

    IF the DNC and or The Clintonites ARE truly serious about this next election…

    then, now is their chance to prove it and tell the Superdelegates that you
    have finally embraced the simple idea that Bernie Sanders in the ONLY
    candidate to have a favorable rating in the electorate.

    Listen up trolls: Not only are we not drinking your kool-aid,
    but the harder you push, the bigger the blowback and
    it is going to be big already.

    Any “Superdelegate” that is an elected official,
    will also be targeted for ignoring the will of the people.

    IF for no other reason than the Superdelegates,
    the ultimate display of arrogance to go against the
    will of the people.

    I may not speak for every Bernie Sanders supporter –
    but I can promise you that I will never vote for Hillary.

    If the Democrats lose this Presidential election,
    then it falls on the leaderships heads for not listening to us
    and for doing everything possible from stopping he whom
    we would want above all others.

    Take heed – I am not the only one that feels this way.

  142. Laurie Katz

    Judy, this is a great point. Can you provide a link to this information for Colorado? How can I look it up for Pennsylvania? I’d like to put all the information together on IWillWriteInBernie.com, unless its already somewhere else?

  143. William K.

    I got a lot of the info here, Laurie Katz. I came to post very much the same info that judyh did.

    My info comes from here: https://ballotpedia.org/Ballot_access_for_presidential_candidates

    I encourage everyone else to read it. My summary is that…

    The deadlines for third party candidates to get on the ballot has already passed, but the deadlines for Independents to get on the ballot has not passed yet. Unfortunately, the Green Party is not on that many states ballots (probably not enough to win). Plus, you also have the issue of a possible split happening where some Bernie folk write-in Bernie Sanders and some write-in Stein. Plus, Stein doesn’t generate the same level of enthusiasm as Bernie. And actually, only 7 states reject write-in votes. Ultimately, I think it’s more to Bernie’s advantage to run as an Independent than to pair up with Jill Stein at this point…

    Out of the remaining 43 states that DO accept write-in votes, 8 accept write-in votes no matter what and 35 accept write-in votes as long as the candidate registers as a write-in candidate by filing some forms within time (and this is the one piece of info I couldn’t find, but it sounds like it hasn’t passed yet based on what judyh said). Other good news is that out of the 7 states that throw out write-in votes, only two are swing/blue (Nevada and Hawaii). Other good news still is that only two states have the “sore loser law” apply to presidential elections, and those two states are red (Texas and South Dakota)…

    Bernie can win by running as an Independent, but we need him to register as a write-in candidate in those 35 states. Hopefully, he has already done this in secret. At the least, he could use the threat of an Independent run to try to flip superdelegates. This is the minimum requirement for him to win in the general election as an Independent…

    It would also help if we could get him on the ballot as an Independent in Nevada and Hawaii. I’m trying to get him on the ballot here in Nevada as an Independent, but it is proving difficult since I don’t know anyone else trying this method (and I need to gather 4,341 signatures within 40 days). Most Bernie folk are putting their eggs into lawsuits about election fraud (look up Redacted Tonight on youtube’s video called Election Fraud Special Report!) as well as doing a massive protest at the convention in Philly. I think everything is worth trying at this point, and he is liked enough to where he could win the general election as an Independent without Nevada and Hawaii.

    I also came up with a great idea for an ad for Independent Bernie in the general election (when his opponents are Clinton and Trump). I have music ready for it already. I’m just a novice when it comes to making videos in flash, so that’s taking a while.

  144. William K.

    Oh yeah! I remember you saying a while back you were going to look up which states throw out write-in votes…

    So, these are the 7 states that throw out write-in votes: Nevada, Hawaii, South Dakota, South Carolina, Oklahoma, Arkansas, and Louisiana.

    Also, the two states that have the “sore loser law” apply to presidential elections: Texas and South Dakota.

    (Note that South Dakota is in both groupings.)

  145. Laurie Katz

    William K- THANK YOU
    The takeaway:
    “Bernie can win by running as an Independent, but we need him to register as a write-in candidate in those 35 states. … This is the minimum requirement for him to win in the general election as an Independent…Most Bernie folk are putting their eggs into lawsuits about election fraud … as well as doing a massive protest at the convention in Philly. I think everything is worth trying at this point, and he is liked enough to where he could win the general election as an Independent without Nevada and Hawaii.”

    I’d like to put that on IWillWriteInBernie.com linking back to your post here. Mind you, I am currently the only signer on IWillWriteInBernie.com. It’s lonely but I am hanging on to the domain, maybe I should have taken WriteInBernie.com, but anyway, its there and I am happy to use it for the cause.

    So the Green Party option is not viable, the only option is the best option, Bernie. It does not help to register as a Green Party member, and it could hurt.
    Glenn’s post from September 2015 above – that Bernie committed to supporting the Dem candidate is true but that was before the rampant cheating by the DNC, and before the interview that Michael Q. Rudnin and I saw this month where Bernie said that Hillary would have to adopt his policies to get his voters’ support… she’d have to win those votes herself. Bernie needs to run as an Independent if he doesn’t get the Dem nomination, and its fantastic to know that we could still write him in in 43 states even if he doesn’t. I wish that was the sole thrust of a united electorate- and maybe it will be.

    I am not at all worried about a 3 way race, Bernie vs Clinton vs Trump, because given the choice of Clinton or Trump, I’d take Trump in a heartbeat*. I also believe that the DNC will continue to fly in the face of all reason and Hillary is their candidate no matter what.**

    What worries me is either a Clinton presidency or an other-than-Trump presidency- those possibilities me up at night.***

    ” …I think everything is worth trying at this point…”
    Agreed. I want to do more phonebanking to California, make the best shot at a big win there, that could reach the DNC. But there’s already plans afoot to compromise that election, 500,000 voters likely disenfranchised (many links, here’s one:http://ktla.com/2016/04/18/up-to-500k-californians-may-be-blocked-from-voting-in-june-primary/)

    Also, an Independent run like this could possibly finish off the DNC and RNC, if they can’t control elections.

    We need to have a fallback position, and you have given us that. Also, very likely they will change the rules after this election, and we will lose the write in option in the other 43 states. This is the crucible, the choice is clear.

    Now to the footnotes:
    * I see Trump as half as good as Bernie and half as bad as Hillary because Trump is for Election Reform, Investigating the Fed, dumping the Trade deals, getting our troops out of the regime change wars, no income tax on those making less than $18K/yr, building our infrastructure and as much of a liar and a cheat he is, he is not responsible for killing anyone, I also do not believe he is a racist or a sexist. His wall is stupid (at least it will make jobs) and he’s not planning to deport more people than Obama already did. I also heard he has added taxing the rich to his platform. Hillary is a killer, she must be stopped.
    ** The DNC has already shown their wanton disregard for the electorate, the DOJ and FBI will never investigate Hillary, they don’t care a fig for lawsuits, or reality. Its obvious the only way Hillary could win is with continuing massive election fraud. It’s already obvious that 2/3 of the electorate would never vote for her (GOP+Independents+>25%of Democrats), the polls, even slanted in her favor have her either within 10 points or losing to every GOP candidate, and they persist in this madness of voter fraud. Either they have some nasty trick up their sleeve for the general or they are just in denial.
    *** Hillary/Other GOP will kill a lot of people, through wars, through cruel immigration policies, lack of health care, and they will close the last freedoms we have left and are trying to use in this election. This is the last chance.

  146. Laurie Katz

    For some reason my site, IWillWriteInBernie.com has not switched to my petition… its still on a petition that closed… again, I am the only signer so far, but here is the correct link for it:

  147. Brad Everson

    Don’ worry, after Republican FBI indicts HRC, Dems will provide us with acceptable alternative like maybe lady senator from Missouri and we’re all smiles. p.s. Nobody that has already voted for Bernie needs to remain registered as a Democrat & should change to Green Party–hopefully a noticeable trend.

  148. Laurie Katz

    William K wrote: “Out of the remaining 43 states that DO accept write-in votes, 8 accept write-in votes no matter what and 35 accept write-in votes as long as the candidate registers as a write-in candidate by filing some forms within time …
    Bernie can win by running as an Independent, but we need him to register as a write-in candidate in those 35 states. Hopefully, he has already done this in secret. At the least, he could use the threat of an Independent run to try to flip superdelegates. This is the minimum requirement for him to win in the general election as an Independent…”

    I can’t imagine that it would be possible to register as a write in candidate in secret.
    Even if it was possible, Bernie wouldn’t do anything in secret.

    I used a date calculator, the general election is November 8, the DNC convention starts on July 25, even if you count July 25 it is only 107 days. Assuming JudyH is correct, it’d be too late to wait for until after the DNC convention begins to start a write in campaign for Colorado (117 days). But Ballotopedia estimates the date as 8/10/2016.

    It is 154 days between the California (NJ et al) primary June 7 and the general election.
    I was unable to find the write in deadline dates for each state on Ballopedia- just their estimates based on 2015, and there’s already some problems with that if JudyH is right, but I will look again later. Hopefully 154 days is enough, after the June 7 CA and other primaries.

    If Ballotopedia is right, 14 States’ filing deadlines to run as an Independent would have passed by the start of the DNC convention (DE, FL, GA, IL, IN, MI, MO, NV, NM, NC, OK, SC, TX, WA), and TX is a “sore loser” state already, and also SD.

    That leaves us 35 states to get the petitions in, or really only needing to get the petitions in for 27 states since
    Write ins would be allowed in these 8 states: IA, MS, NJ, NH, NJ, OH, PA, RI, VT.

    I really need to hear from Bernie that he will do the Independent route after the June 7 primary if there isn’t a big miracle with the DNC. I am also praying that I’m wrong, that it was possible and he did file in secret.

  149. sharonlynneroarkart

    No Green Party no Jill Stein until Jill acknowledges #VETERANS.

  150. polwhiz

    No Hillary Clinton EVER.

  151. sharonlynneroarkart

    Against Killary too but don’t piss off vets.

  152. sharonlynneroarkart

    Apparently you don’t like what I have to say so should I unfollow?

  153. Anonymous


    Please drop the part about voting green and I will support this. In other words, I will pledge to write in Bernie Sanders name if enough others will do the same to give him a good enough shot at winning the Presidency. But I will not agree to do this if some say to vote Green. Supporting the Green Party (which I was a member of both in California and Pennsylvania) is a losing strategy. Progressive democrats will never go along with it because they would thereafter lose the support of the Democratic party which they cannot afford to do. So, drop the Green Party part – which has nothing to do with Bernie’s campaign anyway, and then I will pledge to write in Bernie’s name for President if others will do the same.

    Rob Wheeler

  154. polwhiz

    If you’re in CA, then you should know that writing in a candidate who has not registered as such will lead to ballots being thrown out. This will harm down-ballot progressives, so we’re moving, if any direction, away from a write in strategy. Writing Sanders in will be an act of protest. Voting Green Party will be a revolutionary act. This assumes Democrats keep the Party oriented toward the corporate agenda and nominate Clinton.

  155. judyh

    Here is the site where I found the info on write-in requirements. It is old, from 2008, but the links work and, for Colorado, took me to the correct information. I looked up the appropriate sections in the state laws, too, to be sure.

    In response to Laurie Katz and William K.:

    I think it would be necessary to plan ahead. For Colorado, the filing deadline is very soon after the national convention. We would not be able to gather 5,000 signatures if we wait to see what the convention will do. We would need to collect signatures in advance, assuring signers that we would submit the signatures only if the national convention does not nominate Bernie. In Colorado, the 5,000 signatures have to come from voters who have been registered as unaffiliated from January 1, 2016. That means all the people who registered Democrat in order to caucus for Bernie cannot sign. I think it is very possible to find enough people in several northern Colorado cities to achieve the 5,000 signatures, but it will take planning, organization, coordination, advance work. It will not be accomplished in a weekend after the national convention meets.

    I agree that Bernie supporters may take various mutually conflicting routes if Bernie is not nominated. Some may vote Green, where that party is on the ballot, or may put their effort into getting it on the ballot. Others may write in Bernie. Some may vote for Trump. Bernie has said that he can’t order his supporters to do any particular thing. “You make your own decision,” or something very close to that wording, is what he said in an interview. I agree that we have to let people make their own decisions. I think our best approach is to set up the option for voters in as many states as possible to write Bernie in. If people know that everybody (or almost everybody) can write in Bernie if they so desire, the movement will be attractive and people will feel that they can contribute to a potential outcome instead of feeling that they are throwing their vote away in a futile protest against the system. The Republicans appear to have a real mess on their hands. This could be the most wide-open election we’ve had in decades. So we may have a chance.

    In some states, like Colorado, where there is paperwork to sign, Bernie would have to at least agree to let himself put on the ballot, even if he does not appear at rallies or organize the gathering of signatures. We would need to get his agreement, if we think we can do well enough at organizing a nationwide write-in campaign to make it worthwhile. I interpret his comments as indicating that he himself will support the Democratic nominee, but he will not prevent others from taking different approaches if they want to.

    On the very bright side, look at this web site showing how to write in a candidate in Maryland.
    It won’t be a horrible slog in every state. We need to figure out which states will require a lot of work and which states make it easy. Then focus where we need to focus.

    I suspect that word of a national write-in campaign would get some media coverage.

  156. judyh

    Shoot. Thought I put in the link. Trying again.

  157. Will

    http://usuncut.com/politics/bernie-sanders-sacramento-california/ Everyone! NOW is the time to end the media blackout on Bernie. We need MILLIONS to take this action FRIDAY for it to have a lasting effect. Give these print outs to your friends https://docs.google.com/document/d/1cc4rLqo3q1Uwk6hoywTvQNOBInTZbFuRPw2r8n9Grhs/edit?usp=sharing See the event here: https://www.facebook.com/events/982488475140174/

  158. Robert Schad

    Would you consider joining us at the Democratic national Convention on July 25th, 2016 to deliver your signatures? I am trying to organize petitioners to converge with Bernie Sanders supporters to demand the DNC and Super Delegates choose him, over Hillary, the lesser candidate, who is much more of a liability. Please contact me if you are interested in joining this historic event! Together, we will turn in millions of signatures that together, will change the course of history!

  159. polwhiz

    We don’t have “signatures.” We have pledges and a code of privacy. Depending on the pledged delegate count, we will apply leverage on superdelegates if Bernie is tied or in the lead. If not, we will not although I will be there on the 25th.

  160. Anonymous

    Guys writing in Bernie’s name does nothing. They won’t count it, so its essentially throwing away your vote.
    So if Bernie doesn’t get the Nomination, then voting for Jill Stein is the only real option.

    We need to unite the Bernie or Bust Movement.

  161. judyh

    Hey, Anonymous, it all depends on which state you live in. Maryland lets you write in anyone. Colorado lets you write in a person who is registered as a write-in candidate, but not just anyone, so making Bernie eligible in Colorado will require planning and effort. A few states do not accept write-ins at all. If you know your state’s laws regarding write-ins, you can assess whether a write-in vote for Bernie will be counted.

    Although I favor Jill Stein, she might not be the choice of everyone. There are several parties with presidential candidates on the ballot. I’m not going to tell anyone how to vote. I do believe that you never throw away your vote if you vote for a candidate that you hope will win, no matter how long the odds.

  162. Laurie Katz

    JudyH you wrote exactly how I feel. I did not count it up, but the Green Party isn’t listed in every state, and as you said, there are states (like mine, PA) that allows write ins. Also I read something about the Green Party convention is a week after the DNC convention and they could possibly put Bernie as their presidential candidate, that would be something.
    And we have not yet lost the DNC nomination and all efforts should go in to working toward getting Bernie as many delegates as possible- despite the extraordinary cheating from Hillary (did you hear what happened at the Nevada state convention?).

  163. Judy

    Hello, Laurie. Thanks.

    The Green Party has automatic ballot listing in some states (like Colorado, yay!) but would need signatures in order to get on the ballot in other states. I believe the party (or maybe just Jill Stein, not sure) has a request out for volunteers to get the party on the ballot in states where it is not on automatically.

    The Green national convention is indeed in early August, after the Dem national convention. But I doubt that they would toss out their candidates after months of primaries involving their own party, in order to put Bernie in. If we Bernistas want to, we can vote for a platform that is very much like Bernie’s simply by getting the Green Party on the ballot everywhere and voting for the Green candidate. That will probably be Jill Stein, but it’s not done yet.

    Absolutely true that we have not yet lost the DNC nomination, and it would be far preferable to keep this general election as a contest between two parties with Bernie as the Dem. Not looking good, but still possible.

    If we had known a few years earlier that a candidate as appealing as Bernie would be deciding to run, we should have built up a national party for him/her to run in, and we should have figured out a way to have national televised debates, maybe involving several third parties. It’s the national exposure in debates and the viable national party that are the keys. That’s why Bernie chose to run for the Dem nomination. It’s too much to build from scratch within a year.

    Even if Clinton is the nominee this year, we very nearly succeeded against strong headwinds, and whether Clinton or Trump wins this year, I’m convinced that s/he will mess it up so badly that the voters will be eager for a change in 2020. I’m doubtful that the Dems will want a truly liberal candidate in 2020 any more than they did this time around. So perhaps we should be working on building up the Bernie Party. Or building up the Green Party and hoping Bernie can get their nomination next time.

    Yes, Nevada was outrageous. Shades of Arizona — people registered Dem (as they had to be, because the Nevada caucuses are “closed”, only Dems were allowed to participate) whose affiliation mysteriously changed. People who are willing to give up several Saturdays to attend various levels of conventions as delegates are not going to be de-registering themselves from the party. Some outside entity did that. Wonder who.


  164. Laurie Katz

    Once again, I agree with you on all points. Pity that the chance of Bernie running in 2020 is not good- at 78, but a party of Bernie would be utterly awesome, and the grassroots group that has begun already to organize could make it happen.
    I did not know the Green Party had primaries, I don’t even know if they have one in PA.

    Oh the story in Nevada is much more than that. Shortest form:
    Of the 3 tiers of the caucus, the first Bernie lost (due to Reid having the casinos pay their staff to take time off to caucus for Hillary, and other DNC shenanigans) the second Bernie won (due to more shenanigans that backfired on the DNC, in the end) but in the third that just happened this past weekend, the DNC made up a new rule that the second tier no longer counts and made it retroactive. Evidently Nina Turner showed up with Bernie’s lawyers. That’s the last I heard.
    DNC/HRC just lies and cheats and steals and dirty tricks- they can not win without this.

  165. polwhiz

    Judy, one of our objectives, the “or bust” or Plan B side of #BernieOrBust, is to help get the Greens on the ballot in all 50 states. We’re going to find out what the Bernie or bust army is made of long before the general election.

  166. Judy

    Hey, polwhiz, excellent that one of your objectives is to get the Greens on the ballot in all states. I’m in Colorado, where the Greens have permanent ballot status. Best of luck with the other states.

  167. Judy

    Laurie, where can I read about the retroactive invalidation of the second tier? I’m looking for something unbiased and rational. The details. Word docs or PDFs of the rule change. “Voice votes” in a room full of angry booing where nobody could believe the chairperson would be able to distinguish the ayes from the nays. Things like that. I’ve read lots, and watched many of the videos. But I haven’t seen anything about this retroactive rule that you mentioned. What’s a good source site. I will read as much as you want to offer.

  168. Laurie Rachel Katz (Rachel Corey)

    I am not sure if this is a duplicate post, I am having browser issues… anyway, when I rebooted I found some of what was linked and will add it…

    Judy, what I read about the 3rd tier was on one of the Bernie volunteer sites. It may have been slack- something I joined for phonebanking and I only could figure out how to read it online. Its like a conversation between volunteers. We were calling Oregon. I didn’t go looking for the articles online to verify. (I had found the actual videos from the craziness with the Certification committee on the Second Tier, that I saw myself, and after what happened in NYC I am kind of inured, I know its happening) Someone was in NV and posting what was going on, breathless. I don’t know how to find it. (added, I found these links that were referred from the chat I was watching: https://www.facebook.com/AdryennAshley/videos/10153760730682695/ https://twitter.com/rachelaveryy/status/731547890628186112 -end of added)

    But I just googled “nevada democratic state third tier rule second tier nina turner” and got:

    Basic step-by-step of what went down yesterday at Nevada … – Reddit https://www.reddit.com/r/…/basic_stepbystep_of_what_went_down_yesterday_at/

    Nevada Democratic Convention: Stories of Voter Suppression | Heavy … heavy.com/…/nevada-democratic-convention-what-happened-roberta-lange-delegates.

    Nevada Dem convention devolves into chaos | TheHill thehill.com/blogs/…/279930-nevada-dem-convention-devolves-into-chaos SandersForPresident subthread | Rebrn.com

    rebrn.com/sub/SandersForPresident/?from=2604486 2 days ago – Nevada Caucus – has 3 tiers, 3rd tier wins state/delegates: … Nevada Democratic Party knew that based on the 2nd Tier vote, the 3rd … Motion to have a re-vote of the Temporary Rules was demanded by …. Nevada (11pm Pacific): Bernie’s lawyers filed an Appeal, We Love Nina Turner, Still no Recount.

    Democratic Establishment’s Thuggish Power Grab at Nevada … http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/…/democratic-establishments-thuggish-p... Naked Capitalism 3 days ago – The second tier was made up of county conventions, which Bernie Sanders’ delegates … The third, and final, tier was the state convention, where the delegate counts … The rule change that they voted about was, in a nutshell, … Chaos At Nevada Democratic Convention; State Party Chair Flees Building As …

    Democratic Establishment Steals Nevada Caucus Win From Bernie … http://www.breitbart.com/…/democrat-establishment-robs-bernie-sa... Breitbart News Network 2 days ago – The third tier was the Nevada State Democrat convention. … to pass the rule change and to invalidate the second-tier county convention results.

    I didn’t read any of those, just hope it leads where you’d like to look.

    Is there some place that lists all the lawsuits Bernie’s lawyers have had to file? Nina Turner was prominently involved, so maybe its on the news for her- and as I say that I choke a bit because theres NO coverage of Nina or anything Bernie does, so its going to take some hunting. On that score, is there some place that lists all the legislation Bernie has proposed that he has challenged others to support? Judy, what I read about the 3rd tier was on one of the Bernie volunteer sites. It may have been slack- something I joined for phonebanking and I only could figure out how to read it online. Its like a conversation between volunteers. We were calling Oregon. I didn’t go looking for the articles online to verify. (I had found the actual videos from the craziness with the Certification committee on the Second Tier, that I saw myself, and after what happened in NYC I am kind of inured, I know its happening) Someone was in NV and posting what was going on, breathless. I don’t know how to find it.

    But I just googled “nevada democratic state third tier rule second tier nina turner” and got:

    Basic step-by-step of what went down yesterday at Nevada … – Reddit https://www.reddit.com/r/…/basic_stepbystep_of_what_went_down_yesterday_at/

    Nevada Democratic Convention: Stories of Voter Suppression | Heavy … heavy.com/…/nevada-democratic-convention-what-happened-roberta-lange-delegates.

    Nevada Dem convention devolves into chaos | TheHill thehill.com/blogs/…/279930-nevada-dem-convention-devolves-into-chaos SandersForPresident subthread | Rebrn.com

    rebrn.com/sub/SandersForPresident/?from=2604486 2 days ago – Nevada Caucus – has 3 tiers, 3rd tier wins state/delegates: … Nevada Democratic Party knew that based on the 2nd Tier vote, the 3rd … Motion to have a re-vote of the Temporary Rules was demanded by …. Nevada (11pm Pacific): Bernie’s lawyers filed an Appeal, We Love Nina Turner, Still no Recount.

    Democratic Establishment’s Thuggish Power Grab at Nevada … http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/…/democratic-establishments-thuggish-p... Naked Capitalism 3 days ago – The second tier was made up of county conventions, which Bernie Sanders’ delegates … The third, and final, tier was the state convention, where the delegate counts … The rule change that they voted about was, in a nutshell, … Chaos At Nevada Democratic Convention; State Party Chair Flees Building As …

    Democratic Establishment Steals Nevada Caucus Win From Bernie … http://www.breitbart.com/…/democrat-establishment-robs-bernie-sa... Breitbart News Network 2 days ago – The third tier was the Nevada State Democrat convention. … to pass the rule change and to invalidate the second-tier county convention results.

    I didn’t read any of those, just hope it leads where you’d like to look.

    Is there some place that lists all the lawsuits Bernie’s lawyers have had to file? Nina Turner was prominently involved, so maybe its on the news for her- and as I say that I choke a bit because theres NO coverage of Nina or anything Bernie does, so its going to take some hunting. On that score, is there some place that lists all the legislation Bernie has proposed that he has challenged others to support?

  169. Rachel Corey Katz

    testing- my replies are not posting

  170. Rachel Corey Katz

    OK, I thought i was banned, I have been trying to post a reply (I am Laurie) since yesterday. I think my reply was just too long, or maybe I can’t post links? Shortest form: I can’t find where I original info came from, not sure it would be what you wanted. It was a chat amongst phone bank volunteers calling Oregon for Bernie. I did find some links from that chat and I found a lot more by searching for “nevada democratic state third tier rule second tier nina turner”
    I will try to post the links next. If you don’t see the links posted next, it means I cannot. You could reach me at my Facebook account, but please reply to let me know to look there… I only use that in emergencies… like this… and I don’t check it.

  171. Rachel Corey Katz

    OK the board wont take the links- they were from the phone bank volunteers in Nevada, as it was happening.
    If you can find on facebook, AdryennAshley/videos/10153760730682695/
    or on Twitter rachelaveryy/status/731547890628186112

    Is there some place that lists all the lawsuits Bernie’s lawyers have had to file?
    Nina Turner was prominently involved, so maybe its on the news for her- and as I say that I choke a bit because theres NO coverage of Nina or anything Bernie does, so its going to take some hunting.
    On that score, is there some place that lists all the legislation Bernie has proposed that he has challenged others to support?

  172. Judy

    Thanks, Laurie. I will look.

  173. polwhiz

    They needed approval, and I’ve been very busy. I approved one of your lengthy comments.

  174. Colleen

    Is this true?? Then wouldn’t a write-in still not count unless Bermie properly registers in states that require it??? http://pickyhickey82.kinja.com/the-write-in-vote-what-you-need-to-know-1776993806?utm_medium=sharefromsite

  175. Judy

    Yes, Colleen, Bernie needs to be properly registered in some states in order to be eligible to receive write-in votes. It wouldn’t be the work of a weekend, but it could be done if he will allow his name to be registered. Check the requirements for your state.

  176. Rachel Corey Katz

    Colleen’s link was great. I didn’t check either that page or William’s count of states, and still can’t tell if the Green Party had enough states to win an election.
    The Green Party page also has a great map of where they are and aren’t and could and could not be on the ballot.
    I wonder- and expect the worst- what would happen if there was a mix of Bernie on Green Party and Bernie write ins.
    I am still going to vote defensively against Clinton- if I can’t have Bernie I want Trump, if there is a better chance for Jill Stein, I would go for her. Did I post previously Ralph Nader’s article, “Trump Did Some Good, Hillary is a Dictator”? Every single Bernie supporter has told me the same in person.

    The link suggested that I could help the Green Party with donations if I had maxed out with Bernie, which I have, so I helped the Green Party. I also registered Green (as much as possible in PA, a write in state, one GP says its working on getting on the ballot) and volunteered to help get Green on the ballot.

    I also had an email from the Warren Wing complaining about a DNC move to defang her financial watchdog group. Really, what did she think she was doing and continues to withhold her endorsement of Bernie? Did she think the DNC would throw her a bone or leave her alone if she didn’t come out for Bernie? Has she never heard of “United we stand, divided we fall”? Did she never hear of Martin Niemoller? She’s got to stop sitting on her hands and support Bernie.

    I was looking for that article and found this instead from the Nation “ Why Is Elizabeth Warren Working With a Pro-Trump Republican?”

    and very interesting that article in the Nation is…. so I am far far far from alone in supporting Trump if Bernie isn’t on the ticket.

    oh, now I am confused, I can’t post links but other people can?

    OK those links should come up easily for anyone who cares to search.
    and I prepare to wait for moderation for this to post.

  177. Stanley Shapiro

    Promoting the misogynist, racist, xenophobic, hate-mongering, lying with each and every breath, trillion-dollar tax-cutting Trump in any way shape or form is absolutely bizarre for anyone calling themselves progressive. And does anyone here have the slightest understanding of what the right-wing zealots Trump has pledged to appoint to the Supreme Court will do to equal rights in this country? Must we really let all working, minority and poor people in this country be destroyed in order to save them? Sickening.

  178. Sheila Bilyeu

    PLEASE HELP Bernie get on the ballot as an independent.

    We need over about 90,000 signatures in North Carolina before June 9 deadline.

    That is a better option than write in .

    Please change your pledge to helping Bernie get on the independent ballot in every state( Texas has already deadlined so it would have to be a court issue there)


    Please also read: theforbiddenknowledge.com/hardtruth/billclintonscriminalbackground.htm

  179. polwhiz

    Sheila, we’re trying to get the Green Party on the ballot in all 50 states. It’s a MUCH lower hurdle to jump over. Like you said, it’s already too late in TX.

  180. Rachel Corey Katz

    This nauseating article on 538:
    Is exactly why we need to get the Green Party on the ballot and register Green, but if Bernie isn’t on the ballot, vote for Trump… unless you want Hillary for President.

    “In the YouGov poll, just 55 percent of Sanders supporters said they’d vote for Clinton over Trump in November. However, only 15 percent said they’d vote for Trump. That leaves 30 percent of Sanders voters who say they are undecided, would vote for a third-party candidate or would sit out the election.”

    Straight from a Hillary shill’s written admission, voting for a 3rd party candidate is not revolutionary or protest, it is a vote for Hillary and exactly falling in line with the DNC, doing exactly what they want us to do.

    Bernie or Trump, end the DNC madness, stop Hillary.

  181. Stanley Shapiro

    I didn’t read this right. You think electing TRUMP is the answer to your issues with the DNC? WAKE UP!!! This election isn’t about sending a message to the DNC. It’s about electing Bernie if possible, because he would be the best President of the United States. If he’s not the nominee, he cannot be elected. Period. So then the question is will we or will we not prevent a complete Republican takeover of the United States. This result would be so horrible that the choice can’t be reduced to the simplicity of whether or not we should vote for the lesser of evils. The greater evil in this case is a government — from Congress to the Presidency to the United States Supreme Court to the entire federal judiciary — dedicated to taking away the democratic rights of every woman, person of color, immigrant, and worker in the United States. Just scrub your brain of your Hillary loathing and think of the real consequences of letting Republicans rule everything. If you don’t know what this political Party has tried to do, and through the Republican-run Supreme Court, has actually accomplished with only partial power, read up. Study. Your life and that of the planet — which Republicans deny is warming — is at stake.

  182. Rachel Corey Katz

    Vote your conscience. For me, Hillary is a worse climate deny-er than Trump. Hillary sells fracking around the world, and even when pressed in Miami by Univision, while 20 mayors asked for help because Florida is actually sinking, she still said we had to go to fracking because we’re just not ready for sustainable…
    I am less afraid of the Republicans than Hillary.
    Trump is a show man- he’s worked the media saying outrageous things, but if you look at the history of this guy, he’s always been a liberal. Even his kids didn’t manage to change their registration in time to vote for him. They are liberals.
    Hillary’s a DINO and Trump is a RINO. Like Hillary is always saying, look at her record, and then look at Trump’s. She’s a killer. He’s not.
    I’d rather stay out of endless regime change wars, get out of bad trade deals, INVESTIGATE THE FED AND WALL ST… that frees up the movement to work for climate change. Hillary would destroy the US and maybe the world with it with her crazy banker pals that own our judiciary.
    Its not that I loathe her or have issues with the DNC.
    You can either act out of fear or out of love- you’re so afraid of Trump, and Republicans that you are willing to throw your vote to her, knowing she’s a horror show. They are counting on your fear- as mistaken as the belief some have that she’d be a better bet to beat Trump. She’s not. She’s made people fear Bernie too. Ooooo Socialism… Just like those scary WMD… looking back, who was worse, Saddam or Hillary?
    It’s the ideology of social control, simple as that.

  183. Rachel Corey Katz

    Crap, the more important post I made doesn’t post- not sure why but I will try again… let’s get to working to elect Bernie by phonebanking TODAY right now!
    the link may be why it didn’t post so here it is again but you have to put it together its Bernie Sanders dot com phone bank. Let’s win California and NJ and the other states and have the chance to vote for the best candidate we’ve had in 50 years!

  184. Stanley Shapiro

    You completely ignore what having Wall-to-Wall Republican rule will be all about, while assuming with no evidence, that Trump won’t act like a Republican, sign all the insane, dangerous legislation Congress enacts, and appoint Scalia-like judges to the Supreme Court as he’s promised. If you look at his policy advisers, they are completely compatible with standard, i.e., appalling, Republican policies.

  185. polwhiz

    We are fully aware of the danger; we understand Sec. Clinton as pretty much as much of a threat to climate and peace as The Donald and far, FAR more dangerous than Trump on trade. Obamatrade is forever; Trump’s racist regime will pass into history. If superdelegates want to keep the control of the Court nominees, they need to vote for Bernie Sanders at the DNC. We are revolutionaries, and we refuse to support the establishment candidate or the racist fascist. Your job, Stanley, is to help them understand this. We will not compromise; we are the only adults in the room as they say. http://www.examiner.com/article/bernie-or-bust-pledge-takers-are-the-adults-the-room

  186. polwhiz

    Rachel, we put out a blast to our entire list today to deploy democracy commando tactics nationwide. Those of us who are close to Bernie or bust are busting for Bernie, just not all doing the work you suggest. We don’t oppose your call to action; it’s just not the only effort that needs to be made. Don’t forget to deploy old fashioned email. http://www.examiner.com/article/internet-essential-tool-for-revolutionaries-how-to-become-a-force-multiplier

  187. polwhiz

    Stanley; be afraid. Be very afraid. You have the power to call superdelegates and warn them about us. Our pledge to them is if the nominee is not Bernie Sanders, the Republicans may win unless Bernie runs as a Green to stop Trump and Clinton. We want him to have the Dem. Party nomination, but we’re prepared to help him any way he chooses. If he endorses Hillary, then we’ll work for Jill Stein. We refuse to vote for an int’l, corporate fascist (supporter of so-called “free-trade agreements”)or a racist, nationalistic fascist. Sheep vote for the lesser of two evils; revolutionaries will not or, in our view, should not continue down the road the establishment is taking us on. There’s climate change to reverse, and we cannot wait four more years for a viable revolutionary to come along. #BernieOrBust

  188. Stanley Shapiro

    Please, polwhiz, don’t tell me what my job is. The job I’ve been doing is working as hard as possible to spread the word for Bernie. But being a revolutionary doesn’t mean turning one’s face away from the real possibility that one of the candidates hasn’t even the faintest commitment to democracy and is more than happy to shut down all peaceful protest to his policies. Famously the German socialists and communists weren’t convinced either were revolutionary enough and preferred Hitler. Even if Trump isn’t Hitler, we’d better not have to find out how close he is. In that vein, it’s nice of you to opine that “Trump’s racist regime will pass into history.” Tell that to the vast majority of blacks, Muslims, Latinos and immigrants who will be voting against Trump. They know that they may face the consequences of that racist regime before it passes, or that it will in fact pass only over their dead bodies.

  189. Stanley Shapiro

    Be afraid Polwhiz. Be very afraid. Find me a viable revolutionary option and I’ll be with you. Know that if you work for a make-believe one, you do so at the risk of the overt, racist, fascist coming to power, who will also appoint a Supreme Court that legalizes every step he takes to do away with your ability to ever protest again. That WILL be a revolutionary outcome, but not the one you’re hoping for.

  190. William K.

    In light of Bernie saying he’d “work together with Secretary Clinton to defeat Donald Trump”…

    A Washington Post/ABC News Poll released in late May showed 57% have an unfavorable view of BOTH Clinton AND Trump. (+/-1% margin of error, 46% have a “strongly unfavorable view” of Clinton, and 45% have a “strongly unfavorable view of Trump”)

    Bernie Sanders is only eligible in 8 states as a write-in candidate who has not registered himself as a write-in candidate. However, Jill Stein (Green) and Gary Johnson (Libertarian) are both expected to be on the ballot in all 50 states plus Washington D.C. (Not all the deadlines have passed, and not all the ballot initiatives have been filed, but they are both ahead of where they need to be in collecting signatures.) (Other third party candidates are not going to be on enough state ballots to win.)

    If that 57% that dislikes/hates BOTH Clinton AND Trump unifies behind either Jill Stein or Gary Johnson, Jill Stein or Gary Johnson could become president (and stop BOTH Clinton AND Trump from becoming president).

    The key is uniting people. We cannot have people split between voting for the lesser of two evils (Clinton/Trump), voting for Jill Stein, voting for Gary Johnson, and writing in Bernie Sanders. We need to all back ONE candidate. Part of the trickiness here is either getting Libertarians to pick Stein over Johnson or getting Progressives to pick Johnson over Stein (and Bernie). I propose we use polls from hereon out to see which between Stein and Johnson is gaining on Clinton AND Trump more than the other (i.e. which one out of Stein and Johnson has a better chance and more widely-liked policies), then back that one.

    The other obvious trickiness comes in the form of getting people to think it’s possible. In other words, people have been brainwashed to think they can only vote for Clinton or Trump, and making people see otherwise will prove difficult. That is what the poll showing 57% disliking/hating BOTH Clinton AND Trump is for. That 57% could win on their own, without even having to persuade pro-Clinton or pro-Trump people to vote for Stein or Johnson.

    The other point to make is that, (from Rick Lass, Jill Stein’s New Mexico campaign organizer) “If a [third party] candidate… president, governor, or other statewide office… doesn’t get one, three, or five percent (depending on the state), then that… will disqualify [said third party] and [they] will have to start [collecting signatures to get on the ballot] again from scratch the next time.” So even if Stein and Johnson don’t win, if they get above one, three, or five percent (depending on the state), they will have a stronger start in the next election. Instead of being tied down collecting signatures to get onto ballots, they will be able to focus on spreading their messages. So voting for Stein or Johnson is in NO WAY wasting a vote. If anything, I would argue voting for someone you dislike/hate such as Clinton AND Trump is wasting a vote, since even if the lesser of two evils wins, you’re still screwed.

    (Peaceful protesting at the DNC and RNC are still both great. It will let everyone know how many people hate BOTH Clinton AND Trump, which will help people come to realize how it’s possible to have Stein or Johnson stop BOTH Clinton AND Trump from becoming president.)

  191. Stanley Shapiro

    This is wrong on so many levels, but I’ll make three main points. First, Johnson is a far-right wing reactionary on all but a few social issues. Why any progressive would ever think of supporting Johnson and his complete capitulation to the interests of the rich and his crusade to abolish government is completely beyond me. Secondly the fight for a progressive reorientation of politics can only succeed with an expanded electorate. If Trump gets to replace Ginsburg and Breyer, along with Scalia’s seat on the Supreme Court with the array of extreme right-wingers he’s identified, that Court will affirm all the voter disenfranchisement laws already on the books, and a raft of additional ones that Republican governments throughout the country will be enacting. Those disenfranchised will almost entirely be black, brown, young, female and poor. Letting that happen would simply be death for the progressive movement.

    Third, when we speak about the lack of a difference between Hillary and Trump we are confessing that we are blind, deaf and dumb to the insidiousness of racism, xenophobia and misogyny in this country. Trump is loosing those forces throughout the country as a mere candidate, and his validation of them will increase in force a hundredfold if he’s President. Do you want that on your conscience? Not me.

  192. William K.

    Misogyny like the Bernie Bros exhibited? Racism as in “super-predators who need to be brought to heel?” Xenophobia as in “super predators?” Face it: Clinton is at least as bad as Trump. The difference is that Trump will stab you in the front while Clinton will trick you then stab you in the back. There’s no good in either of them, just tons and tons of evil. Clinton won’t appoint justices that are against Citizens United, for gay marriage, etc. You will only get one progressive issue from her Supreme Court appointees, abortion, and I for one am not willing to settle for her getting one issue correct and every other issue horribly wrong. That’s not good enough.

    Trump being president won’t be on my conscience either, because I’ve tried to get the more electable Democrat (Bernie) nominated, and because I’ll be voting for Jill Stein (unless Gary Johnson pulls ahead, which I don’t think will happen because more of the country is progressive – I expect Jill Stein to pull ahead as the Bernie people learn about her, after July 25th). I say that in my other post because the 57% that dislike BOTH Clinton AND Trump will include progressives, moderate liberals (who don’t trust Clinton despite agreeing with her), moderate Republicans, and conservatives (who don’t trust Trump despite agreeing with him). Uniting those 57% will inevitably mean people conceding on some issues, and uniting those 57% is the only way to stop BOTH Clinton AND Trump from becoming president. Being stubborn about issues could very well be what allows either Clinton or Trump to become president.

    Clinton and Trump’s abysmal approval ratings seem like a curse, but they are also an opportunity. This is the perfect storm – the chance for a third candidate to break through and become president. Any third party candidate winning the presidency will shatter people’s brainwashed belief about “wasting their vote on a spoiler candidate.” Thus, it will pave the way for all sorts of third party candidates thereafter. (Jill Stein and Gary Johnson will both have their hands tied by a corrupt, clique-driven congress anyway, so I doubt either will succeed at getting much done. The main goal is to stop BOTH Clinton AND Trump as well as restore actual choice to the American voter.)

    … Anyway, what I really came here to post was a clarification for anyone reading. Months ago, I thought Jill Stein had to get on every ballot as a Green candidate, but now I know she can actually do a combination of Independent and Green. For example, in Nevada she will be on the ballot as an Independent, but in California she will be on the ballot as a Green. All the votes for Jill Stein in various states will still go to Jill Stein regardless of this. Anyway, that’s why my post from a few months ago had that part wrong. In states like Nevada, for example, she had/has missed the third party deadline, but she was able to get on the Nevada ballot as an Independent. So she is expected to be on all 50 states after all! 🙂

    My apologies for misinforming everyone a few months back. You can also help Jill Stein get on the remaining states’ ballots in time by doing what her website says here: http://www.jill2016.com/ballotaccess

    (At the time of me posting this, it appears the Nevada ballot news hasn’t been updated on her site yet. Either that or they’re waiting till it’s 100% official: they’ve turned in enough signatures, but the county clerk or whomever may not be done processing the signatures/registration.)

  193. Stanley Shapiro

    Look, all of us here were for Bernie, but I think that caused some of us to overboard on the Hillary hatred. Yes, she runs around with the wrong (i.e., Wall St.) crowd, but not only. Labor, minorities, women are all in her camp and she, unlike Trump, has to pay attention to them. Just like Bill. That’s why Bill appointed two great Supreme Court justices, Ginsburg and Breyer who are stalwarts on the whole range of progressive issues, not just abortion. Hillary would appoint the same kind of judges, the polar opposite of who Trump would appoint. Sorry, that really, really matters. You can’t downplay it. Also, Hillary and Bernie voted about 93% the same way when they were in the Senate. Hillary is a mainstream Democrat. It’s not what we want. But we shouldn’t pretend it’s the same as what you get with a Republican.

    Bernie is a great politician. He wouldn’t have gotten as far as he has if he weren’t. So I’m ready to follow his lead. He’ll know whether what he gets from Hillary in exchange for his support is enough and reliable. If he says go with Hillary, I’m there. If he decides that a third party run for him is actually viable and could result in him beating both Trump and Hillary, I’ll be there. But let’s not jump the gun, assume he can win just because we want him to, and risk a catastrophic all-Republican government for the next 4-8 years. It’s no way to make a revolution.

  194. polwhiz

    Bernie or bust has never taken instruction from Senator Sanders, and we sure as hell are not going to start behaving like sheep. We are revolutionaries.

  195. polwhiz

    Do you want all the blood Hillary will shed on your conscience? We don’t.

    Try barking up a tree of people who gives a crap about your whiny three points.

  196. Stanley Shapiro

    You have no information, no argument, no rationale. You just have Hillary-hatred and revolutionary pretensions you use to puff yourself up. God help this country if because of people like you we get an overt fascist as President of the United States, someone who just in the last 48 hours made it perfectly clear he despises a free press and wants to arm lunatics with assault weapons. Someone who unashamedly scapegoats everyone but white men, which I believe you are, as worthy of prosecution and persecution because they’re not really Americans. Talk about bloodshed and conscience. I hope to God you don’t have to deal with yours after your crazy scenario spinning leaves us with Donald Trump as the next, and the last, President of the United States.

  197. Judy

    Stanley, we hear this all day every day from both the Republicans and the Democrats as they berate each other over the unfitness of their presumptive nominees. Both sides are right. Stop trying to guilt-trip people who support Bernie. If you have a constructive suggestion for avoiding the election of both Trump and Clinton, let’s hear it.

  198. Stanley Shapiro

    There is no way to avoid the election of both. I’m as sorry as you that we don’t have a political system that lets us. But if we actually want a political revolution, instead of merely talking about it, we have to deal with reality. That means putting up with a non-fascist government headed by Hillary Clinton for four years enabling her to fill the Supreme Court with non-fascist judges who won’t uphold every voting restriction that Republican legislatures come up with. Then we will actually be able to vote. That comes first. In the meanwhile, we use the next four years relentlessly organizing the forces that emerged during Bernie’s campaign and try to build alliances with minority forces that for one reason or another were alienated from it. We build up not just nationally, but locally. We start to take over school boards, city council seats and legislative seats. At some point we will be able to contest again for national power, maybe even in four years if the crisis continues. Maybe with another Democratic insurgency or maybe through a third Party. But we don’t start by shooting ourselves in the head by blocking Hillary and getting the Mussolini-wannabe, and may actually be, instead. That’s not just a greater evil; it’s pure evil.

    So this isn’t guilt-tripping, it’s reality we need to come to grips with. We need to take the long view.

  199. johnspritzler

    The reality is that we live in a dictatorship of the rich where the election system does not enable ordinary people to have any real say in government policy. The reality is that we need to build an explicitly egalitarian revolutionary movement that does not rely on voting. This is what http://www.PDRBoston.org is all about.

  200. Brian davis

    Please ask Bernie Sanders to join forces with the Green Party and Jill Stein. The Democrat Party is a dead fish.
    Jill Stein has intelligence and ethics. The DNC , by staunchly supporting a corrupt, pathological liar, has given Sanders a perfectly legitimate reason to change course. The DOJ will not indict Hillary. Obama’s endorsement has confirmed that will not happen. Best of luck.

  201. polwhiz

    We have a petition asking him to hold talks with Jill Stein:
    However, he’s focused on defeating Donald Trump; and the poll we commissioned indicates he’s be a spoiler.
    #BernieOrBust will pivot to vote Green if the superdelegates vote for the corporate tool, Clinton.

  202. polwhiz

    Hillary is nearly as fascistic as Donald Trump. We are revolutionaries, and we do not vote for establishment, corporate tools. That’s the reality you superdelegates need to come to grips with. http://www.examiner.com/article/who-is-more-fascistic-donald-trump-or-hillary-clinton

  203. Stanley Shapiro

    She is not “nearly as fascistic as Donald Trump.” Fascists stir up race hatred, nativism, and other forms of divisive sentiment on a regular, consistent, ongoing basis as part of a strategy to accomplish dictatorial power. Clinton is a corporatist, granted, but not someone who will actually seize power and maintain it with military force, or create a new military force from racist recruits as a counter to the regular army. Donald may well do the latter based on his actions and rhetoric. You can suggest that corporatists are also undemocratic, and certainly they are interested in manipulating the system to keep their class in power, but they won’t actually abolish the democratic institutions that those of us who seek a peaceful revolution will need to utilize to accomplish our goals. And even if Trump doesn’t abolish those democratic institutions, he will appoint judges who will approve disenfranchisement schemes so numerous and varied that millions of our voters will effectively be excluded from supporting our candidates. If those things don’t add up to a significant set of differences to you, then so be it. They do to me.

  204. Judy

    Give it up, Stan. Nobody here is buying it.

  205. Stanley Shapiro

    That’s your response? Impressive.

  206. polwhiz

    Stan, there will be a seizing of power under Clinton, a series of coup des lois. One of my few criticisms of Bernie is his weak criticisms of the TPP. It is a Trojan horse for corporate rule in the U.S., and there’s no exit clause. Also, I’m not confident Hillary’s SCOTUS selections will be any better than Trumps; that’s how little I trust her.

    Look, if you want to vote for #CorporateClinton in November, knock yourself out; but you’re wasting our time trying to convince us to.

  207. David Breed

    I am hoping for a nationally organized write-in for Bernie to take place in the November election.

  208. Judy

    David, what kind of nationally organized effort are you hoping for? The rules for write-ins vary from state to state, and the paperwork must be done state by state.

  209. polwhiz

    David, Bernie would have to register in the state to be recognized as a write-in candidate. Otherwise, the votes won’t be counted at best and discarded at worst.

  210. David Breed

    What I was hoping that some of the big organizations with many followers such as MovOn.org, DFA, or any progressive org. would advocate to its members to write-in Bernie instead of holding our noses and voting for the lessor of two evils. Our two party system has failed us, along with the media, to perpetuate this lousy system by having different rules set up in each state! How will anything ever change for the better? Maybe we are just doomed!

  211. johnspritzler

    Instead of saying “We’re doomed” let’s start building an egalitarian revolutionary movement, as discussed at http://www.PDRBoston.org .

  212. Linda Davis

    I don’t understand why this activist organization and others persist in pushing for Bernie to be the Democratic Party nominee as it is a lost cause. Bernie, an Independent, has sold out because he isn’t willing to take his so-called political revolution all the way, which he could do if he would run as an Independent. He claims that he made a commitment not to run as an Independent if he lost the Democratic Primaries, which was a stupid thing to do. His plan to now focus on forcing change within this monster is lost on me. His support of Hillary is a contradiction to everything he has said over the last year on the campaign trail. Why start something if you’re not ready to finish it? If he is so afraid of Trump becoming President and he realizes that HRC can’t beat Trump, it would make good sense to throw his hat in the race as an Independent. With that being said, I am voting for Jill Stein and that’s where my money will go from this point forward. To hell with the DNC, HRC, and BS.

  213. Rachel Corey Katz

    Can anyone clarify if the Green Party can actually win the presidential election? I checked the Green Party Ballot Access page (I have donated to support and offered to volunteer as well) http://www.gp.org/ballotaccess. I haven’t done the electoral college math to see if they have the same 20 or so states that could win via electoral college, and I am not quite sure what they mean by “in progress” and “coming soon”- is it possible they could get these states on by November?
    Great Britain just voted to exit the EU, change CAN happen… but need to know the reality of what we’re facing. Also note that the Green Party Nominating Convention comes AFTER the RNC and DNC. This could be a beautiful thing.

  214. Stanley Shapiro

    The Green Party has zero chance of winning but a good chance of helping elect the mysoginist, racist, xenophobic madman who will tilt the Supreme Court into the most radical rightwing institution this country has seen in 150 years.

  215. Judy

    Stanley, the Bernie or Bust site is not the best place to be looking for converts. Have you tried the NYT?

  216. Stan Shapiro

    Just wondering if now that Bernie has sadly acknowledged he won’t be the nominee, you really want Bust.

  217. Rachel Corey Katz

    LOL Judy- I have Stanley Shapiro on ignore…

    Since i am posting, here’s something I found interesting and informative to share regarding the Brexit Vote:
    “… The British people might think that they are out of the EU, but they are not. They have a long hard fight ahead. Washington and the British political and media establishments that serve Washington are not going to let them leave.”

  218. Stan Shapiro

    It seems Rachel you also have Trump on ignore, unlike Bernie, who slams him daily. Pretty clear to me folks here have indeed chosen between Bernie and Bust. You’ve made a bad choice.

  219. Judy

    Hello, Rachel. I interpret the ballot access map to mean that the “in progress” states have deadlines still in the future, and that teams of folks are out there gathering signatures to get the Greens on the ballot in those states. These efforts may or may not be successful. Judging by the e-mails that I receive from Jill Stein’s campaign, the planning was a bit lax and it remains to be seen whether they will get enough signatures before the deadlines. In the states where they are going to court to attack the “draconian” requirements, there is also a whiff of mistakes being made in regards to maintaining awareness of requirements and deadlines. Things do slip through the cracks when many campaign workers are inexperienced volunteers. Can’t be helped. It’s hard to maintain steady progress toward a distant goal when the deadline seems far in the future, and it’s almost impossible to make up the lost effort in a flurry of activity the night before the term paper is due. I think minor parties were surprised by the realization that this election cycle might be their best chance in decades to break into the bigtime.

    So you shouldn’t bet on the Greens being on the ballot in all 50 states. And although mathematically it might be possible to win a presidential election by taking 75% of the vote in a small number of high-delegate states, that’s not a realistic scenario. It’s like thinking that Bernie could make up a 300-delegate gap by winning 90% of California. Mathematically, yes. Realistically, no. It’s going to be a four-way race this year. That will make it hard for any party to get an overwhelming majority in any state. Since the Repubs and Dems have a head start, the reality of what we are facing is that the Greens won’t be sweeping the nation this year.

    On the positive side, I think there is a good chance that the Greens (and the Libertarians) will be on the stage with the Republicans and the Democrats for the debates this fall. And as a result of that publicity and being on the ballot in most states, both the Greens and the Libertarians will get many more votes than they have gotten in the past and will qualify for permanent ballot placement in those states in the future. So getting on the ballot won’t be as much of a scramble next time around. And there will be a vastly greater likelihood of actually winning next time around. This election should be viewed as a rebuilding year, as they say in sports. Don’t despair. You aren’t throwing away your vote if you vote Green. You are building up the party for next time. I’m betting neither Trump nor Clinton will last longer than one term.

  220. Judy

    Stan, since that is now clear to you, I’m hoping you’ll stop trying to recruit us for Hillary.

  221. Judy

    Linda, why are you so mad at Bernie? He made a promise that all candidates make. He is true to his word. I wish the Democrats would nominate him. I wish the Democrats would adopt his entire platform and make Hillary sign in blood that she will enact it. We’ll see how cleverly he can negotiate for that second possibility. But going with the Stein campaign seems like a good move. The Stein platform is very similar to Bernie’s. You’ll be voting for most of the same policies that Bernie would have tried to enact.

  222. David Breed

    It may be difficult, but if we take a long hard look at our two party system you might see the Texas two step dance taking place. The Dem’s take us one step forward, then the GOP two back. It is hard to make any progress this way. Bernie is one of the most honest politicians to come along in my lifetime! We need real change and not empty promises!

  223. polwhiz

    In other words, we should just be cowards and vote for #CorporateClinton and her particular form of corporate fascism.
    #NoThanks http://www.examiner.com/article/bernie-or-bust-movement-is-growing-and-will-demand-bernie-or-lose-november

  224. Rachel Corey Katz

    Just listened to a Bernie volunteer team call and learned that no, Bernie did not say he would vote for Hillary, Bernie did not say that Hillary would be the nominee, none of that. That was some more of the usual MSM twisting of what was said. Without wanting to get personal I do want to advise that it looks like “Stanley Shapiro” (if that is a real person and not one of the millions of shill accounts created by Hillary’s campaign) is a troll plant for Hillary. His job is to spread the Hillary narrative, discourage and disparage Bernie supporters, try to divide us. Note that he seems to have blown off after I said I put him on ignore. I recognized his tone as the same that other identified plants for Hillary on Social Media use. (Always on the attack, Get In Line, Be Afraid of Trump, the sky is falling only Hillary can save us blah blah blah… ) He’s been outed. Likely to come back under another name but you will recognize the tone. The advice of the Internet: Don’t feed the trolls. 🙂

  225. Judy

    Rachel, Bernie did say that. Here is a link to the Morning Joe program
    and another to the CNN interview
    The interviewers ask him point blank and he says yes. They check again, just to be sure, and he says he wants to prevent Trump. So it’s clear that he is not endorsing Hillary, not saying she is going to be good for America, but he is saying that she is likely to be the nominee and he will vote for her if she is.

    Now of course if something happens that prevents her from being the nominee (FBI investigation, RAP billboard on highway persuades super-delegates) I’m sure he’ll be happy to accept the nomination. And if Jill Stein rises in the polls, gets on the ballot in 49 or 50 states, makes a good showing in the fall four-way debates, I expect Bernie will reconsider. His goal is to defeat Trump, in whatever way that can be accomplished. If Stein looks like a better bet, I think he’ll vote for her. So we are right where we’ve always been. Work like hell to make the Democrats nominate Bernie and, as a back-up, work like hell to get Jill Stein in front of the general public so people will see that they have a realistic alternative to Trump/Clinton.

  226. Judy

    Love the sign. It just might work. Bernie has about 45 percent of the Democratic vote and 45 percent of his supporters won’t vote for Hillary. That’s .45 X .45 which is .2, or 20 percent of the Democratic voters won’t vote for Hillary. Assuming that a sizable number of unaffiliated voters will also find her unacceptable, it looks like Hillary will need to be moving rightward to woo Republicans. Not a good look for a Democrat. Might offend even the Dems who think they will vote for her now. If we can get Stein out there in the public view, people will see they have someone else to vote for.

  227. Stanley Shapiro

    I was away which is why I didn’t answer you Judy. But it’s hilarious that you think I’m a Hillary troll, since I spend much of my time being blasted by Hillary supporters for not being supportive enough of her now that she’s the nominee. I also run the website for Philadelphia Neighborhood Networks. Why don’t you check it out to see if you can find any signs of Hillary trolldom there: phillynn.org. Or check out our Facebook page and let me know if you find any there: https://www.facebook.com/groups/phillynn/ Here’s the truth. I’m all for Bernie and for him getting as much of his program incorporated in the platform as he can, and whatever other assurances he can get that the platform will be implemented. I’m then in for the long struggle to accomplish revolutionary change. But unlike some folks on this site, I don’t believe the way to go forward is to start by antagonizing millions of black, brown, immigrant and female voters by pretending, against all evidence, that Trump is anything other than their mortal enemy. I don’t believe the next step in the revolution is to put a madman’s finger on the nuclear trigger. I don’t believe the next step forward is to let him pack the Supreme Court with right wing fanatics who will undo today’s Supreme Court decision and again relegate abortions to back alleys. Not to mention make voting for all the oppressed communities I just mentioned nearly impossible. I just don’t believe those things. If you’d like to demonize me for those opinions, go at it.

  228. Judy

    Um, Stanley, I didn’t call you a troll. Another poster did. But even if I didn’t say it, I’ve been thinking it. So I’m not going to be offended. Hillary will get us into another couple of wars. Hillary will appoint Supreme Court judges who approve of Citizens United, thus perpetuating the whole corrupt political process. Hillary and her buddies tried to suppress the vote during the primaries. Hillary is not the friend of black, brown, immigrant and female voters. As for supposedly “demonizing” you, don’t change the subject. It’s not all about you. It’s the ethics. It’s the inequality. It’s the violence. It’s the lies.

  229. polwhiz

    Stan, we consider Hillary to be a greater threat than Trump. That is why we will build an opposition movement against her if she’s nominated, and we’ll tell that to the superdelegates in coming 2-3 weeks.

  230. Stanley Shapiro

    I agree Judy it’s not about me, it’s about the ludicrous idea that Hillary is more dangerous than Trump. It’s just spectacularly, incredibly, bizarrely wrong. Bernie knows it; Elizabeth Warren knows it, and according to the polls the vast majority of Bernie supporters know it. The people posting on this website do not. To suggest that Hillary will appoint Citizens United supporters to the Supreme Court is just one example of your willful distortion of reality. Hillary as Senator spoke against and voted against both Roberts and Alito, two of the key votes for that woeful decision. In the Senate she voted like a mainstream Democrat, 93% of the time the same way as Bernie. Yet, out of thin air you conclude that she will appoint judges as if she were a Republican. Hopefully there aren’t enough reality deniers like you to put the madman in office who will in reality cement Citizens United into law forever.

  231. Judy

    That she, for other reasons, voted decades ago against two judges who supported that recent decision does not suggest that she opposes that decision. Heck, Hillary even says out loud these days that overturning Citizens United would be one of her requirements for any judge she would nominate. Guess what — I don’t trust Hillary Clinton. She says a lot of things these days that she hasn’t said for the past 35 years. I think her record is a better predictor of her real positions than the uncharacteristically leftist statements she has been making this spring. Hillary goes where the money is, and the money is with Citizens United.

    By the way, very little in law is cemented forever. The Supreme Court modifies and even overturns previous decisions. There would not be the perpetual discussion about abortion rights being in danger if the original pro-choice ruling were the last word on the subject. So Trump will not be able to cement anything. It’s a sign of the essential weakness and unpalatability of Hillary Clinton that the main argument being trotted out by the Dems to support her lesser-of-two-evils status is that at least she won’t nominate right-wing extremist judges. That ought to go without saying.

  232. polwhiz

    Stan, Hillary’s corporate fascism will be FOREVER! Trump’s racism will pass with time. Yes, Hillary is more dangerous than Trump. Obama has appointed a Citizens United supporter in Merrick Garland; why wouldn’t #CorporateClinton.

    You really need to find another place to post comments Stanley; you’re wasting our time here. Join the sheep if Bernie doesn’t get nominated.

  233. Stanley Shapiro

    I suppose Bernie’s a sheep too, polwhiz, since he said he’s voting for Hillary. You think that if you toss around the “revolutionary” word, it makes you superior and so much more noble than those who understand that it’s a long, twilight struggle that occasionally requires half-steps and strategic compromises. No, “revolutionaries” must put their heads down, charge full speed ahead, and pretend there’s no wall ahead of them. And I love it when you so smugly assume that Trump’s racism will “pass with time.” Are you someone who will be subject to that “passing” racism, polwhiz? I have the feeling not.

  234. polwhiz

    No, Bernie is the sheep dog. He knows we are not expected to follow him. We are leaders, not followers. Revolutionaries, not sheep.

  235. Rachel

    Of course it would have been the best if Stein or Sanders had won but we didn’t have that choice.
    Thank you America, no Clinton/NWO.

    I am sure you heard them on CNN saying all night, “maybe they were right about Sanders having a better chance to beat Trump”.

    Yay no TPP! Yay to avoiding WWIII!!!!!

    They are still trying to spin this, to not accept the reality of the voters’ statement and that our media obsoleted itself. It has brought together the real revolutionaries and now there is real opportunity for third parties and real change.

    And I hope you are going to continue to lead us into our Revolt Against Plutocracy! Now we can pour our money and our efforts into protecting the environment. I’m now donating to NO DAPL and Wikileaks.

    Wonder if there’s any chance Trump will help Assange… and Snowden.
    Superdelegates must be abolished. Election reform! Build the Green Party!
    Did you hear the Mosquito Fleet succeeded against the oil companies?

    We can do this!

  236. Wry Grin

    There is a vitally important issue which must be addressed to stop the subjugation of Americans by those who despise and exploit them.

    Blackbox electronic “voting” is the digital death of democratic representation in government.

    The Russians and/or who knows who all else just took advantage of an easy opportunity, much as car thieves who can’t resist stealing luxury vehicles left unlocked with keys in their ignitions.

    Things which should be known beyond all doubt:

    How many eligible electors were removed from the electronic database rolls? Who were they, and who removed them?

    For the massive majorities of electors forced to use paperless DREs, ballot opscans, polling precinct communications computers, and central tabulators built by foreigners and owned/operated by private corporations, exactly what hardware, firmware, and software – including backdoors – were involved? Exactly what chain of custody existed, if any, for all devices and removable media used on those devices?

    What security measures were implemented, if any, to the modem transmissions of data sent from polling precincts to county elections officials?

    If these things can not be known beyond all doubt, the results of any “election” are invalid.

    At least paper ballots counted by hand can be observed throughout the process.

    Any American who appreciates the ideals on which the USA was originally based would fight to the death for representation in government, as this nation’s founders were willing to do. If this “election” were legit there would be nothing to fear for the status quo, but if not it would signal a clear call for the restoration/implementation of genuine democratic processes in this republic.

    Questioning the blackbox is totally appropriate.

    The rigged “voting” systems don’t allow for valid recounts or audits.

    Too many vital states use completely inappropriate electronic “voting” systems. Florida uses paperless and other suspect equipment in its major population areas. Michigan uses paper ballots but they are “counted” with opscans shown to be subject to tampering. Wisconsin is worse, with some paperless systems even more easily manipulated with no hope of recounts. Pennsylvania is by far one of the worst examples of a state forced into use of a totally paperless DRE-based system allowing for no valid counts or recounts. The Commonwealth of Pennsylvania, as numerous other states, replaced real voting by the use of antiquated Asian mystery hardware/firmware/software accessible by myriad entities including but not limited to felons, rabid partisans, traitors, and foreigners such as Chinese and Russian hackers. There are touchscreens subject to various types of tampering including backdoors and simply applying viscous substances to the screens. Pedro Cortés illegally stopped PA citizens from demanding that the “voting” systems be examined by experts because he knows they’re defective and easy to rig.

    People in most states have to wait in long lines to try to use such unreliable machines when using paper would be much faster and more convenient. You can’t expect valid elections when you outsource them rather than making sure they’d involve ballots and counts made in the USA.

    In strategic population centers of over 40 states, actual counts of real ballots have been replaced by the use of foreign-built devices owned by unaccountable corporations. These electronic systems are proprietary and of undisclosed design, build, programming, and operation. They are vulnerable to easily-concealed manipulations and known to lose, switch, and fake votes. Even mailed, absentee, and other handwritten ballots are manually fed into hackable opscans, and the central tabulators are particularly problematic. They were unsecured and obsolete when new and that was over a decade ago now. Thus democracy dies via digital disenfranchisement.

    Some wonder why more tech savvy young people don’t turn out to vote. Those young people wonder why they try to call it that.










    A very partial list of computer experts who have pointed out the problems includes, but is not remotely limited to:

    Aviel Rubin, PhD, Professor of Computer Science at Johns Hopkins University
    Edward Felten, PhD, Deputy U.S. Chief Technology Officer for The White House, formerly Professor of Computer Science at Princeton University
    Michael Fischer, PhD, Professor of Computer Science at Yale University
    David Dill, PhD, Professor of Computer Science at Stanford University
    Rebecca Mercuri, PhD, Computer Security Forensics Consultant, former Fellow, Radcliffe Institute, Harvard University
    Douglas Jones, PhD, Professor of Computer Science, University of Iowa
    Herbert Thompson, PhD, Adjunct Professor of Computer Science, Columbia University

    See also:


    Watch this video for an excellent summary:


  237. Kerry K. Phillips

    The contract is proven effective strategy. However, the terms are still too specific. Concentrate on those things required to survive, and those required to thrive. Apply technology to lower the energy ($) needed to survive (Health, Housing, Food & Water (fuel)), and increase those required to thrive; access to knowledge and the ability to act (intellectual and physical resources). Define Independence as Access to Survive and Thrive. i.e. Health Care industry grows larger and our dependency greater despite billions in research and advancement. The goal is to minimize of eliminate need, not breed dependency. Technology is used in every aspect of our society except application of the law and more important, application of individual independence. Create a new paradigm. Define Life as that required to survive and Define Thrive as access, Define both as Independence. Economic message – individual and localize production over centralized mass production (independence over dependence). One economy feeds the growth of the people the other feeds off the people. Use the open source, open ed., open gov., makers marketplace as examples. Redefine Capitalism as dependency and feeding on, and free market as that which reduces cost of survive and increases access to thrive. This is a science based model designed on the construct hydrogen and D.N.A-R.N.A. The issue is simply application of knowledge. Is it used to consolidate ownership, dependency, enslavement. Or is technology used in conjunction with our biological selves. This strategy rebuts and circumvents the arguments of the opposition and leave them is a hole of their own making.
    Best of Luck Thank You all for your service

  238. Christopher A. Brown

    citizensagainstplutocracy.org needs to examine what Lincoln referred to as “the people are the rightful masters of the congress and the court.” He could of only been referring to Article V.

    But Article V is done by the states, and the koch bros. have bought the state legislators of 26 states and are getting ready to re write the constitution for corporate profits.

    The strategy found here.

    And the audio presentation that gets into some of the aspects of it

    Are Lincolns plan, but applied to the issues of today instead of slavery. Call me if there is interest. Chris, 8059674055

  239. politicalwiz55@aol.com

    Chris, I’m aware of the Balanced Budget Amendment. These people are dangerous right-wingers who either don’t know about monetary reality or are banking on enough people not knowing to push their extreme right-wing austerity amendment.

  240. Christopher A. Brown

    politicalwiz55 the balanced budget amendment only opens the door on the convention because it is acceptable to all of the states. Once the door is open, if state Citizens are not prepared to act VERY quickly, the koch bros could destroy protections for the environment that seal our fate. Money ain’t everything.

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